Archive lectures and events

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Okay, right? Well, a very good evening. Everybody clearly is nothing decent to watch on the television at the moment. If you will come to watch me. But thank you all very much. I see some old friends amongst the faces.

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So uh, it's very nice to see you all right. I've just lost my presentation, so I'll just pop around for a moment.

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Uh while I find it.

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She's just not there, is it? So? Just bear with me. When's it gone?

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Hmm.

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Just me trying to get on with it all loaded up. Ready now it's disappeared.

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And do something else which is very annoying.

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That screen to the other one. Just bear with me.

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That.

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Maybe I can do that.

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I'm enough. Just emailed it to you. If that helps.

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Now I've changed it since you.

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Um.

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I should have tried to streamline it a wee bit.

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Thank you. That's very thoughtful.

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You know. Got it.

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Right here we get that loaded up.

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Okay.

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Don't come along.

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On the screen. Please.

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That's better.

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That's a.

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It slideshow.

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Match, and then I need to go back to share.

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Move.

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Time.

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And find the share. Button.

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Right. Come on!

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Like it.

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Press go, but I can't press go. Is that in the way.

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Very well. This meeting's been transcribed, but I can't get behind the banner to.

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Press, the go, button.

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Jonathan, I can help with some.

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Come on. It's the top bar. CC, this meeting has been transcribed. Okay.

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Hmm.

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Okay? Ah, right, we can get to slideshow.

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Now! Hooray.

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Hope.

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That right. We all see that.

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We've got a WA. Banner.

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We don't.

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Yes, no, Lauren, tell me.

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You know. Yep.

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Yeah. Good. Okay. Right?

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Okido. So recent developments in Romana, British archaeology in this country.

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Before you a whole set of wonderful gems which will come to a little bit later. However, we're going to start off with a very newsworthy story indeed, that at Norton Villa Norton, Disney Villa, just south of Lincoln.

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Now this was 1st noted in the in the 19th century sort of engravings of the of the Mosaics were published.

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And more of it came up in a field in the plough in the 1930 S.

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When I well, I wouldn't call it an excavation. A clearance took place. Let's put it like that.

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And we had this plan.

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Eventually published, now.

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It's rather odd. Villas don't normally have great defensive ditches around them, which we clearly see here, and further beyond as well. There's something a little bit odd about Norm Disney.

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Now there it remained until quite recently. Now a little bit of one of the mosaics is surviving today in the village hall in Nilton, Disney.

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Famous for 2 things, one, Walt Disney's family came from there, and B.

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Norton Disney. Horse trials take that place there, too, worth knowing.

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So this is one of the bits of the mosaics which is mid second century and date, which was recovered from the 1930. Excavation. Of course, in the 19 thirties we lived in a black and white world, and here we can see 2 of the rooms exposed.

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With the mosaic floors showing with the tessellation around the outside. This is a tessellated pavement.

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And the mosaic proper in the very center. There now terribly exciting, as black and white mosaics go, especially in the black and white world.

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However.

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Couple of years ago. Um, a company decided it. Want to build a wanted to build a massive great animal.

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Products, rendering plants.

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In the fine little village in Milton Disney, which, as you can imagine, they weren't wildly keen about. However, the local archaeology group decided.

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To carry out lots of survey work in the whole region.

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And geophysics, field walking and trial trenching, and discovered, in fact, that the villa sits in the middle of a very large.

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Several hectare in extent.

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Industrial area involving iron mining from the local Lincolnshire.

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And um.

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Smelting activities and all sorts of things.

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So in the process.

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Are putting in some trial trenches to have a look assessment trenches, as we would call them today. The Norton Disney.

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Uh came up with this. It's a rather fine object. It was featured in the National Press uh, and this came from a large or early 4th century rubbish pit uh. In part of the extra mural area around the villa proper.

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Now.

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It is a Roman.

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Cast bronze.

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Dough, decahedron.

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And you go. Good Lord.

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Rather a curious thing. It's also technologically, ridiculously difficult to make, because it has to be cast. And, as you can see, it has 12 faces and 20 corners. If that's the right.

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Word angles, apac.

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Each one of which has a knob cast onto it.

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You'll notice that there are holes in it, and the holes are in 4 different sizes, and you think hmm! Not exactly a case of one size fits all.

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This was photographed on display in the Civil War in Newark, and more recently it's be on display in the County Museum in Lincoln.

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Now, these don't Getchahedra have always kind of puzzled people, because we don't really know what they're for.

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But having another one to look at and play with is always a good idea.

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This is some of the collection in the Landers Museum in Don, for instance, and you can see a very similar example.

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They are on the left hand side.

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Top one slightly plainer, and the one on the right has solid plate surfaces, and is still decorated with uh, with little ringlets on it, and so on. One of the explanations that the textbook gives us for dodecahedra is, they were used for divination, for seeing into the future that sort of idea.

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Now one example here from Gene.

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These are the plates which were sold together.

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To create the entire deckhahedra.

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And in this case the 12 faces have the.

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The, the.

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Sagittarius, Virgo, and so on. Germany off all the 12 months.

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Which does kind of fit with the idea that they might have been used by the priesthood in a temple. Perhaps.

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For divining the future.

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Um not much point in asking when Julia Caesar was going to be assassinated, because we know, is on the eyes of March.

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But this is the sort of thing that it suggested, that these things might before.

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That's the solid ones. However, more of the 133 examples known are of this form.

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Solidly cast, quite junky, made of bronze.

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With these 20 knots on the 12 on the.

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Corners of the 12 faces, and very clearly holes. This very chunky example comes from a museum collection in Ireland. That is not where it was found. It was a residual collection from an antiques dealer who left his collection to the local museum in Waterford. But it's a very good example of these very robust, solidy, constructed uh objects. These dodecahedra.

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So I got to thinking, and you may have seen on digging for Britain. This object was featured as well.

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And it seems to me.

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That these holes were clearly for something.

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And the fact that they're hollow suggests that something was put inside them.

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And this is a reconstruction of a Roman military balister.

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It is a very powerful.

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Anti-personnel device that throws a very log, a meter long or thereabouts.

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Prosper arrow bolt, whatever you want to call it accurately for about 150 meters.

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And these things are pretty deadly.

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Pretty much. Most Roman infantry regiments had at least one on their complement.

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And this drawing gives you an idea of how they were constructed.

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Their retort.

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Instrument.

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And, as you can see, there is a very long meter, long or thereabouts projectile with an iron head.

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And it seems to me that if you, with the thread your dodecahedra on here.

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Using the appropriate sized holes, and here I've done so on my kitchen broomstick.

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Now this is a modern.

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Um printed facsimile.

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Buy them off the Internet.

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And it seems to me that uh, if you were to stuff this with moss.

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Or straw, that sort of material.

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Bit of sulfur bit of soul pit, perhaps.

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Um, and then wang it towards your position.

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Then you've got yourself a rather fine incendiary.

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Um. The knobs, I think, are to create turbulence in the air, to force oxygen into this while it's still burning.

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It only has to be on the on the broomstick on the Arrow for a couple of minutes uh time of, you know, firing to time of flight, and given that the Roman army were, generally speaking, during the conquest of northwestern Europe, and and Britain in particular, were firing at.

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Targets rather like this. This is a facsimile reconstruction of an iron age roundhouse.

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This is just outside Laos.

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Um on the a 16 bypass place called Kell. It is publicly accessible on the Boy Scout Camp.

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It's made of wattle and daub. It has a thatched straw.

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And if you can imagine a meter long projectile with a steel point on it, um!

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Gently arcing down, having been aimed at this thing at some considerable distance, and then it embedding itself into the thatch itself on top. Here.

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That dodecahedron sliding, and it's to the little holes down the shaft with the impact.

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Embedding it into thatch. That would be a very, very effective incendiary device. And my stress, this is my idea. Nobody else's other people have had other ideas too.

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A museum director I shall not name thinks. Therefore, make, therefore, knitting gloves.

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I don't really think that's terribly likely. But anyway.

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Here are 2 fragmentary examples from 2 of the thoughts on Hadrian's wall.

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Which puts them immediately into a military context.

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And, as you can equally be seen, these 2 examples have broken. They have shattered, perhaps on impact.

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Hitting something a bit harder than a straw roof, perhaps, and there's a fair degree of corrosion, and so on.

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Going on inside them here.

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That sort of corrosion could easily be started off.

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By having had.

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Burning material sulfur, whatever inside them I would suggest. Now, there's no proof of this made one to fire it to anybody. Yet.

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But the fact that we find fragmentary examples from the walls on Hadrian's wall.

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This example, for instance, was metal detected from a field in Belgium.

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And again, you can very clearly recognise the knob and the part of the circular hole there, which makes it very, very clearly. Part of one of these dodecahedra.

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So it is my.

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Purely my considered opinion that they may well be some sort of incendiary device.

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And that our friend, living in his villa down in Norton.

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Picked it out of the ashes of the.

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The Iron H. Pill, or whatever that his regiment was besieging, and took it home as some sort of keepsake.

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Ended up in a rubbish pit when the entire house was taken down or redeveloped, or whatever.

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Just imagine the last time you had a major out at home, and you filled the skip outside with all sorts of bits and pieces you didn't want anymore. Well, that's the sort of idea here, I would suggest.

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This distribution map shows you the locations of the 133. So far.

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Recorded Roman Dodecahedra, and, as you can see, they are all in northwestern part of the Roman Empire. In Britain, France, Germany, specifically couple on the Danube frontier as well, and these are all areas of military conquest, from Caesar's garlic wars in the fifties BC. Through to the invasion of Britain in 43.

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And I think it does suggest.

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The the military use of these sort of objects. The fact that some of them have been found in military contexts sort of fits, with that quite neatly. So. We must think, then, of our Roman auxilia regiments like these gentlemen here, with their ballista.

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Uh, using these things as incendiary devices.

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To be fired into in a Hillforts, iron age defended or hidden, undefended with straw roofs and wattleland or walls.

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Uh incendiary warfare, of course, is a very effective way of terrorizing your enemies.

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Um.

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The bits of these ballista have been found, indeed, in several by regiments of auxiliary infantry.

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Okay, so that's the.

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A rather amazing Norton Disney.

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Dodecahedra.

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Now I want to move on to a site at Fenstanton, in Cambridgeshire.

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Located between Huntingdon.

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And Cambridge. Now, this area, of course, today is undergoing massive economic um development.

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The University, and all the science parks, and so on in Cambridge, of bringing in lots and lots of population numbers, and many of the little villages in this area are being upgraded with new housing, and so on.

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And Fenstanton is in this case absolutely no exception.

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So a real photograph.

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We can see the A. 47. I think it is dual carriageway running across the country, the edge of the original village envelope up here, and planning consent has been granted for this triangular plot.

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To be redeveloped for housing.

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You can see the tree preservation orders have been placed on the existing trees which been left alone.

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Machine up hereing the top soil off.

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And this area.

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In the so in the county historic environment record has shown, Roman finds in the past, and thus an excavation is being taken place. What we can see down here. It's a very large.

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Gray line there, which is a ditch which is a cross. Sections cut through. It's an enclosure, and there's a number of graves down here from a cemetery.

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So this is all quite.

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Sort of regular planning controlled archaeology being taken place.

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By a commercial contractor. In this case Albion archaeology, who, I think, are based in Bedford.

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So here's 1 of those graves under excavation.

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And under Martin Home Office rules. You can't have the public on site.

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Or if you're excavating Graves, they've got to be screened off.

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And everything's got to be treated with respect, and so on. As it should be. So there is a human burial under excavation. It's a very specific human burial.

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These are the bones thereof.

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So they were recovered on site.

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Bagged.

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By limb, taken back to the laboratory for the palaeopologist at the particular contracting unit to look at.

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To look for evidence of disease.

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Things that affect the bones which could be detected. And that's where the Palio pathologists come in.

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Now.

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The skeleton is relatively.

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There's nothing terribly exciting or particularly wild about it, and it certainly wasn't noted during the excavation.

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But.

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Very careful looking at the feet.

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Suddenly revealed. Good heavens.

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There is a whacking great.

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Iron, nail.

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Driven.

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Right through the ankle bone.

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And you go. Whoa! What's all that about them?

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Well.

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You could possibly have had a pretty dodgy carpenter making the coffin and knocking a nail through the side of it. But this is a big.

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6 inch nail type of thing. It's not small at all, far bigger than you need.

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Manufacturing a coffin.

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And the fact that the nail there's its head on the far side there has penetrated with very neat hole right the way through the heel bone means. This is perfectly deliberate.

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And you go. Oh.

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And suddenly alarm bells start ringing.

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This is a modern museum display of a human foot.

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In the Israeli Museum in Jerusalem.

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And here's a Roman nail driven right the way through the heelbone.

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With a.

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Plate of timber washer behind it.

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So this is the outsiders foot, obviously, and this is the inside of the foot. So if we go back to our example from Stanton.

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There it is!

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Right the way through the solid part of the bone. It is very, very clearly a deliberate act.

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And the only.

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Circumstances we can think of.

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This might represent.

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Is. It, in fact, represents a crucifixion.

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So what we know of from the Roman world is.

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The victims who were crucified.

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What? What uh? Tied to the crossbeam, as we see here with rope, and only in the case of the base down here.

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Do we have a nail driven through each of the ankle bones?

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Into the wood of the actual.

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Vertical bar of the crucifix.

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Crucifixion, as though well attested in the Roman world. Historically.

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Very, very rare to find archaeologically.

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And indeed, there is only 2 other examples known.

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One is from Jerusalem itself, and another one is from Italy.

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So that's how we think it worked, and the hu. The raison is.

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That crucifixion. You basically.

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Starve to death.

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Up on the poll if you don't bleed to death through the wounds down below here.

00:21:49.000 --> 00:21:56.000
Now it would be very easy, therefore, the dependence, the family, whatever of the poor victim who'd been.

00:21:56.000 --> 00:22:01.000
To Victor to some heinous crime, and was condemned to crucifixion.

00:22:01.000 --> 00:22:02.000
To.

00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:05.000
Sit there for 48 h, or longer.

00:22:05.000 --> 00:22:08.000
Um, and just basically wither away.

00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:17.000
From dehydration as much as anything else on the crucifix, but to stop people coming and cutting down.

00:22:17.000 --> 00:22:25.000
Nerdy, well relative, and carting them off and recovering them by nailing them through here with these expensive iron nails.

00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:27.000
It means family and friends can't come and.

00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:32.000
Liberate the poor crucified victim they nailed there.

00:22:32.000 --> 00:22:38.000
So they have to wait until they die, and some people try and break their necks, and all this sort of idea to recover them.

00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:45.000
So the idea of this is, we think, is to keep the body nailed to the cross.

00:22:45.000 --> 00:22:49.000
So this is the example for the Israeli Museum in Jerusalem.

00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:55.000
It is not a named individual, it's from a cemetery, and there is that.

00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:58.000
With a great nail driven right the way through it.

00:22:58.000 --> 00:23:02.000
I hope you have no duty yet. This is all a bit gruesome, isn't it? But all the same.

00:23:02.000 --> 00:23:06.000
This is archaeological evidence. So.

00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:08.000
If we go back to our model.

00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:09.000
Here is the same.

00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:12.000
Artifact I've just shown you from Jerusalem.

00:23:12.000 --> 00:23:17.000
And here is the modern facsimile, showing how that works.

00:23:17.000 --> 00:23:19.000
Notice the space here.

00:23:19.000 --> 00:23:27.000
And that's the space occupied by that timber washer that's been put in to pull the foot inwards.

00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:31.000
Against the shaft of the crucifix itself.

00:23:31.000 --> 00:23:33.000
Now, of course there are.

00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:36.000
It wasn't very, very famous example of crucifixion.

00:23:36.000 --> 00:23:51.000
And of course, you know, the stigma is the holes in Christ's ankles, and indeed in his hands. Now that's never been found very clearly, but this is evidence of crucifixion. This is the only.

00:23:51.000 --> 00:24:03.000
Proven crucifixion, victim from Romano, from Roman Britain at all, from this little agricultural settlement out on the edge of the Cambridge fan, and you think, good heavens.

00:24:03.000 --> 00:24:06.000
What could this individual have done?

00:24:06.000 --> 00:24:09.000
To to deserve this sort of punishment, but.

00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:20.000
It is empirical evidence, and we like empirical evidence because it's certain the rest of the settlement was fairly standard from agricultural settlement.

00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:27.000
Um with ceramics from the late second through to the early 4th century BC. Az. Rather.

00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:50.000
So we see very clearly here valley cups with painted decoration on them. Lake 3, rd early 4th century flagons, folded beakers uh jugs, and large grayware vessels and drinking vessels down here on the right hand side as well. So that's all. Pretty standard. Nothing stands out about this one burial.

00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:53.000
And something which is rather fun.

00:24:53.000 --> 00:24:59.000
Are these little enameled plate brooches they called horse and rider figures.

00:24:59.000 --> 00:25:06.000
Certainly 2 cm long, as you can see from the scale. These are enameled a flat cast plate brooches.

00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:12.000
And they are found in East Anglia and Lincolnshire. Specifically, there's some sort of.

00:25:12.000 --> 00:25:22.000
Tribal area that these represent, and they may perhaps have something to do with the god essay. Pona, who is the goddess of horse riding and horse riders.

00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:24.000
So it may be some sort of.

00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:25.000
Um.

00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:29.000
Protective Idea.

00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:41.000
For those who spend a lot of time on horseback. So quite extraordinary the information that comes out of this pretty standard commercial excavation in Cambridge, that Fenstanton.

00:25:41.000 --> 00:25:46.000
Which gives me pretty much half an hour. My final subject, which is.

00:25:46.000 --> 00:25:56.000
Connected with Hadrian's wall in some senses. So there is the entire line of Hadrian's wall, and if we kind of zoom in.

00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:58.000
Towards Carlyle. Here.

00:25:58.000 --> 00:26:02.000
Out the western end we see that we have 2 forts.

00:26:02.000 --> 00:26:05.000
Stan, Wix, and Carlisle itself.

00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:13.000
Practically on top of each other, and that's the only place on Hadrian's wall we see this particular phenomena.

00:26:13.000 --> 00:26:14.000
So.

00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:16.000
Why can this possibly be.

00:26:16.000 --> 00:26:21.000
Answer. Thank you. The Ordnance survey map 1, 60.

00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:26.000
Carlisle itself lies on the south bank here of the river Eden.

00:26:26.000 --> 00:26:29.000
We have a conquest period.

00:26:29.000 --> 00:26:32.000
Dating 71, 72 Ad.

00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:41.000
From the Roman governor, Carialis. We have the later walled town, Theum built around it.

00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:53.000
Here is the river Eden, flowing from right to left, out into the way first, st and we have a second fort here at stomachs. Stomach called Patriana.

00:26:53.000 --> 00:26:56.000
Now this is part of Hadrian's wall.

00:26:56.000 --> 00:27:00.000
This line here is indeed Hadrian's wall.

00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:07.000
Said, goes out to its mile castles along the way coast. So that's why we have 2 forks.

00:27:07.000 --> 00:27:08.000
Conquest, period fought.

00:27:08.000 --> 00:27:11.000
And a Hadrian's Wall period thought.

00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:17.000
Built from 122 onwards, when Hadrian's wall is starting to be built.

00:27:17.000 --> 00:27:20.000
Now this particular fault at Stanwix is.

00:27:20.000 --> 00:27:27.000
A very unusual thought, because it is the only thought on Hadrian's wall.

00:27:27.000 --> 00:27:32.000
That has a garrison of 1,000.

00:27:32.000 --> 00:27:36.000
A cohort's miliaria equitates.

00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:37.000
The only one.

00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:44.000
They were sometimes referred to as Hadrian's firefighting force. This sort of thing there.

00:27:44.000 --> 00:27:46.000
So they're highly mobile.

00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:53.000
Crack cavalry troops, and they sit in this position at the end. The western end of Hadrian's wall.

00:27:53.000 --> 00:28:04.000
We didn't. We don't know much about the 40 self at Patriana, simply because it's got modern Carlyle suburbs built all over it. Anyway, that's the location.

00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:08.000
Are now going to take you to the cricket ground, which is here.

00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:13.000
That area. There is.

00:28:13.000 --> 00:28:17.000
The cricket ground off.

00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:24.000
Parallel cricket club at the Edenside ground. Well, that's fairly obvious. There's the River Eden looping right the way round it.

00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:27.000
Thought itself lies.

00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:45.000
Beyond the main road. Up here on the hillside, and during the terrible floods which affected Carlisle and the river Eden Valley in 2,015. No great surprise. The cricket ground was inundated, and the clubhouse was rather badly damaged.

00:28:45.000 --> 00:28:47.000
So.

00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:59.000
They put a planning application in to build a new one here, as well as some water defences around the sides here to try and stop what is very clearly the flood plain.

00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:02.000
And in so process thereof.

00:29:02.000 --> 00:29:03.000
Shing.

00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:06.000
A small excavation took place.

00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:07.000
With a new.

00:29:07.000 --> 00:29:10.000
Route. The new pavilion was to be constructed.

00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:15.000
Small. The Commercial Excavation Uh Company.

00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.000
And suddenly things started leaping out of the ground.

00:29:19.000 --> 00:29:23.000
And the most important thing was.

00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:24.000
This.

00:29:24.000 --> 00:29:28.000
Fragment of an inscription.

00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:29.000
It's.

00:29:29.000 --> 00:29:35.000
We can, we can reconstruct most of it. And in translation it basically says.

00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:37.000
Mother, of.

00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:40.000
Our most Holy Emperor.

00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:49.000
And of the army erected by the senate and country, and this particular form of dedication, when you expand the whole thing.

00:29:49.000 --> 00:29:51.000
A specific.

00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:53.000
2, the Empress.

00:29:53.000 --> 00:29:55.000
Julia Domnier.

00:29:55.000 --> 00:29:57.000
Now Julia Domnier was the wife.

00:29:57.000 --> 00:30:00.000
Of the Emperor Septimius Severus.

00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:05.000
And he and his wife, and 40,000 troops.

00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:06.000
Rocked up in Britain.

00:30:06.000 --> 00:30:13.000
In 208 Ad. Until Septimus died in York in 211.

00:30:13.000 --> 00:30:17.000
And their son Caracalla took over.

00:30:17.000 --> 00:30:18.000
Hence.

00:30:18.000 --> 00:30:22.000
To the mother of our most holy Emperor Caracala.

00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:25.000
Under the army, etc. Etc.

00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:26.000
Now this.

00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:29.000
Fragmentary inscription was found in this.

00:30:29.000 --> 00:30:33.000
Rather unappetising looking archaeological, trench.

00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:38.000
But, as you can see, there is one bit of Roman masonry upstanding.

00:30:38.000 --> 00:30:40.000
And all of this dark.

00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:43.000
Charcoal, flecked grey material.

00:30:43.000 --> 00:30:46.000
Is medieval, robbing.

00:30:46.000 --> 00:30:49.000
Backfill.

00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:54.000
Now, if we think about the situation in Carlisle in, let's say.

00:30:54.000 --> 00:30:58.000
1090, something like that, just after the Norman Conquest.

00:30:58.000 --> 00:31:04.000
1st thing William wants to do is fortify his northern border, and he builds Carlisle.

00:31:04.000 --> 00:31:06.000
And Carl Castle, it would appear.

00:31:06.000 --> 00:31:11.000
And the wolves broke. Carlisle were probably built.

00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:15.000
From the ruins of a very large bathhouse.

00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:18.000
So all this backfill.

00:31:18.000 --> 00:31:21.000
Is relatively early. Norman.

00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:22.000
Digging out.

00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:28.000
Well, 1st demolishing and then digging out the buried walls of a large.

00:31:28.000 --> 00:31:30.000
Previously unknown.

00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:31.000
Bath, house.

00:31:31.000 --> 00:31:33.000
Complex.

00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:35.000
Now you can sort of get an idea.

00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:37.000
Of the depth of the whole.

00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:42.000
From the edge of the bulk. Here down to standing material.

00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:47.000
And the fact that most of the site is backfilled.

00:31:47.000 --> 00:31:51.000
Medieval rubber trenches.

00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:55.000
So this is what a rubber trench looks like. So imagine.

00:31:55.000 --> 00:32:02.000
You're working for the new. Whoever the lordship was, Carlisle in 1090.

00:32:02.000 --> 00:32:13.000
And your job as sheriff is to get that castle up as fast as possible, so, rather than going and quarrying stone, cutting it and carting it to the building site.

00:32:13.000 --> 00:32:17.000
What you do is you locate your nearest big Roman ruin.

00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:21.000
Which probably had walls standing above ground.

00:32:21.000 --> 00:32:22.000
And that.

00:32:22.000 --> 00:32:36.000
Ruin would have very large squared off precut locks. Just the sort of thing to go building your castle and your wolves around Carlyle, and that is exactly what's happened here.

00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:44.000
So we're looking at negatives. This linear thing is that rubber trench that's the film still being excavated here.

00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:49.000
These are the intact floor surfaces on either side.

00:32:49.000 --> 00:32:51.000
Where the walls once.

00:32:51.000 --> 00:32:52.000
Stood.

00:32:52.000 --> 00:32:54.000
One wall.

00:32:54.000 --> 00:32:58.000
Rudimentarily survives here, with the wheelbarrow run on the top of it.

00:32:58.000 --> 00:33:00.000
And these are all fallen.

00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:06.000
Piles of ply which held up the floor in the bathhouse.

00:33:06.000 --> 00:33:10.000
With the hot gases running underneath it, such that you would burn your feet.

00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:14.000
Now this excavation is being going on as a community project.

00:33:14.000 --> 00:33:22.000
Uh since 2,020. I think it is the last season finished last week.

00:33:22.000 --> 00:33:29.000
And still it goes on as a community archaeological project in Carlisle.

00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:43.000
Now I think they've had about 800 volunteers coming and working on the site which has been under professional direction and excavated in association with the Tully House Museum, which is the main museum in Carlisle.

00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:48.000
And the amount of material the museum's now got from this is enormous.

00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:52.000
Now one of the features of Roman bath houses is their drains.

00:33:52.000 --> 00:33:59.000
And even if all the walls and all the ceilings, and all the big swanky stuff above ground.

00:33:59.000 --> 00:34:00.000
Has been demolished.

00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:06.000
And the stone carted away, and I emphasise big squared blocks like Lego bricks if you like.

00:34:06.000 --> 00:34:08.000
In terms of you know.

00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:17.000
Proportion of being carted away to build Carlisle. What they aren't going to do is dig out the drains because they're below floor surface.

00:34:17.000 --> 00:34:22.000
But Roman bathhouse drains are rather wonderful things.

00:34:22.000 --> 00:34:23.000
Because a.

00:34:23.000 --> 00:34:27.000
You'll see very clearly. See, they are capped.

00:34:27.000 --> 00:34:28.000
With capstones.

00:34:28.000 --> 00:34:37.000
And in some cases water still indeed runs through them, and the Romans, being Romans, means this wonderful bathhouse.

00:34:37.000 --> 00:34:41.000
Has a really fine set of underground drainage.

00:34:41.000 --> 00:34:47.000
Now you can see the Roman concrete of the floor. That's a floor surface. There.

00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:49.000
Flush with the capstones.

00:34:49.000 --> 00:34:51.000
And here we have 2 drains.

00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:53.000
Meeting.

00:34:53.000 --> 00:34:58.000
The confluence, and you don't see it all beautifully slabbed along the bottom.

00:34:58.000 --> 00:35:05.000
But the one thing about Roman barthouse, particularly where they belong to the Roman army.

00:35:05.000 --> 00:35:08.000
Is, if we actually excavate the fill.

00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:12.000
The gunge, which is in the bottom of the drains.

00:35:12.000 --> 00:35:17.000
That has remained static since the Roman period.

00:35:17.000 --> 00:35:22.000
And as a consequence, everything that was in that.

00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:23.000
Survives.

00:35:23.000 --> 00:35:28.000
So by very carefully removing and sieving.

00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:36.000
All the fill from the drains the excavators have recovered, I think, 72. Now.

00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:41.000
Gemstones, all of which are from finger rings.

00:35:41.000 --> 00:35:42.000
So.

00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:47.000
You're in the great bathhouse, wearing nothing but your finger rings.

00:35:47.000 --> 00:35:49.000
Wherever you were, them.

00:35:49.000 --> 00:35:56.000
And the metal, the gold or the bronze, or the silvery ring in the hot water expands.

00:35:56.000 --> 00:36:03.000
Um! The glue with which the gemstones are set into your ring melts.

00:36:03.000 --> 00:36:10.000
As a consequence, all of these have fallen from the rings on Roman fingers.

00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:12.000
In the bars themselves.

00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:14.000
And become washed.

00:36:14.000 --> 00:36:20.000
Into the drains, and they are magnificent. I think there are 72 last count.

00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:33.000
This one. Here is a parrot, for instance, we have all sorts of hair here, and many gods, and God esses and demi, gods and godasses, or various different deities.

00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:41.000
These are about a centimeter long and about 7 mm wide, and they are cut.

00:36:41.000 --> 00:36:48.000
Oh, integral! In other words, they're cut into semi, precious, semi, precious hard stones.

00:36:48.000 --> 00:36:54.000
Things like courts, and Charles Seveny and Rock, crystal and Jasper.

00:36:54.000 --> 00:37:05.000
Many of these dark pinky ones. Here are Jasper and the finger ring specialist at the University of Oxford, recently retired.

00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:12.000
Thinks there's actually a gem cutters workshop in Carlisle itself.

00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:15.000
All of these have numbers on them. They're small, fine numbers.

00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:25.000
Where they, the 3 dimensional location of these, is actually being recorded within the drains themselves. So you think of all the unpleasant things that went down.

00:37:25.000 --> 00:37:29.000
For the birth. Our strains. These are very exciting things indeed.

00:37:29.000 --> 00:37:30.000
And.

00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:32.000
With careful.

00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:37.000
Not microscopic photography, but with careful lighting. Cross lighting. In this case.

00:37:37.000 --> 00:37:46.000
We could very clearly see the actual demi God. S. In this case, who's a figure? He's on the ring itself.

00:37:46.000 --> 00:37:49.000
And these would have been used originally.

00:37:49.000 --> 00:37:59.000
In the same way as 18th century signet rings were used into ceiling wax.

00:37:59.000 --> 00:38:04.000
So they're rather like a signature for authenticating documents in wax.

00:38:04.000 --> 00:38:10.000
That's how we think they were actually used. So this is, in fact, the goddess.

00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:14.000
Who is the goddess of harvests.

00:38:14.000 --> 00:38:18.000
And uh fertility of the soil. This sort of thing.

00:38:18.000 --> 00:38:20.000
And she actually has her hands here.

00:38:20.000 --> 00:38:22.000
On a plough.

00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:24.000
There! That's the shaft of a plough.

00:38:24.000 --> 00:38:25.000
Coming, down.

00:38:25.000 --> 00:38:29.000
And she's usually got grains of wheat and that sort of thing around her.

00:38:29.000 --> 00:38:33.000
All these little scratches on the surface are wear and tear.

00:38:33.000 --> 00:38:36.000
During the usage of that ring.

00:38:36.000 --> 00:38:40.000
Integral set into the finger ring itself.

00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:47.000
There's also a cornucopia here, a horn of plenty again showing the crops. So, although.

00:38:47.000 --> 00:38:52.000
This is a military bathhouse belonging to the reign of Septemia. Severus.

00:38:52.000 --> 00:39:00.000
Uh! It seems that other people from around the neighbourhood are also coming in who may well be involved in agriculture.

00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:07.000
Now Hadrian's Wall, as a as a total garrison is about 18,000 troops.

00:39:07.000 --> 00:39:09.000
All of whom have to be fed.

00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:14.000
So there's clearly a vibrant market economy in foodstuffs.

00:39:14.000 --> 00:39:17.000
In the wall, fort and the wall area.

00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:20.000
That probably applies to why we have series here.

00:39:20.000 --> 00:39:27.000
This is another example in Citrine this time. But again it is series. The same goddess.

00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:34.000
And you can see the hand on the cloud again down here, and there's the cornucope on top.

00:39:34.000 --> 00:39:35.000
So these are little.

00:39:35.000 --> 00:39:41.000
Masterpieces of classical art that were worn on the finger.

00:39:41.000 --> 00:39:45.000
And they've come out in the hot water of the.

00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:52.000
This is uh Jasper, and it's a again with one, we think, probably from the local gem cutting workshop.

00:39:52.000 --> 00:39:53.000
And it's pan.

00:39:53.000 --> 00:39:57.000
Goat legs, as you can see, hairy thighs, and all the rest of it.

00:39:57.000 --> 00:40:01.000
And Pam is a an attendant.

00:40:01.000 --> 00:40:04.000
Of Dionysius, or back us, if you will.

00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:10.000
Um, which are therefore involves alcohol and wine, and all the other things that go with it.

00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:15.000
You know. What did the Romans do from us? Well, apart from the bathhouses, the drains, and the wine.

00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:22.000
Remember. So that's what that's about. It's about Veno collapsing by the ampere.

00:40:22.000 --> 00:40:28.000
Also sitting in the drain was this extraordinary object, and you go. Hmm!

00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:35.000
Right. It's a lump of purple something or other. Yeah, you're right. It is.

00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:42.000
Analysis at the University of Newcastle upon Tyne shows that this is a lump of beeswax.

00:40:42.000 --> 00:40:43.000
Which has.

00:40:43.000 --> 00:40:45.000
They did in it.

00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:49.000
A very large lump of Tyrannian purple.

00:40:49.000 --> 00:40:51.000
This is the die stuff.

00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:57.000
From the Mediterranean, from those poor little Murex shells which were gathered by their millions.

00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:01.000
And this little secretion from their liver.

00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:02.000
Was extracted.

00:41:02.000 --> 00:41:04.000
Posthumously. Of course.

00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:11.000
And oxidized in the sun to create the famous purple dye, the imperial.

00:41:11.000 --> 00:41:15.000
And it appears that it's been carried around to the northern.

00:41:15.000 --> 00:41:19.000
Dissolved in these works.

00:41:19.000 --> 00:41:22.000
Now this is the purple dye that the emperors use.

00:41:22.000 --> 00:41:33.000
And Roman laws. They're called sumptory laws. Prohibit anybody below the rank of emperor. Having clothing died with this material.

00:41:33.000 --> 00:41:35.000
So it's very much a cipher.

00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:38.000
For an Imperial presence.

00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:41.000
So we've got a dedication on the bathhouse itself.

00:41:41.000 --> 00:41:48.000
To Julia Domnier, and I wouldn't assume, therefore, that there are high ranking officials.

00:41:48.000 --> 00:41:51.000
Involved with the court.

00:41:51.000 --> 00:41:54.000
And indeed the presence of the Emperor Septimus himself.

00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:58.000
Which explains the presence of this purpley stuff.

00:41:58.000 --> 00:42:00.000
It is as rare as hen's teeth.

00:42:00.000 --> 00:42:04.000
And to my knowledge this is the only example.

00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:06.000
Surviving from Roman Britain.

00:42:06.000 --> 00:42:09.000
Of imperial purple, dye.

00:42:09.000 --> 00:42:12.000
Okay. I hope you're terribly impressed.

00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:17.000
Because the excavators of Carlisle were very impressed indeed.

00:42:17.000 --> 00:42:21.000
When the Pilar, these stacks of.

00:42:21.000 --> 00:42:24.000
Oof, let's do, dog on! Here we are, these stack.

00:42:24.000 --> 00:42:31.000
Of flatish Roman bricks were found to be impressed before firing.

00:42:31.000 --> 00:42:33.000
With the imp mark.

00:42:33.000 --> 00:42:35.000
In periodom.

00:42:35.000 --> 00:42:36.000
By.

00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:37.000
Uh, so it's.

00:42:37.000 --> 00:42:38.000
Aye.

00:42:38.000 --> 00:42:42.000
MP. Got it. It's a rebus.

00:42:42.000 --> 00:42:54.000
And uh again, that is, by authority of the Emperor. Now the tiles were made at a local just down the Solway Valley, about 5 or 6 kilometers away.

00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:56.000
Um from Carlisle itself.

00:42:56.000 --> 00:42:59.000
And they have clearly been made by imperial edict.

00:42:59.000 --> 00:43:03.000
For this large military bath house.

00:43:03.000 --> 00:43:06.000
Now.

00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:08.000
You go on to.

00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:11.000
X, whatever it's called these days. And you look up.

00:43:11.000 --> 00:43:12.000
The um.

00:43:12.000 --> 00:43:16.000
The feed for the Carlyle diggers.

00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:35.000
And you'll find lots and lots of people carrying on the excavation and holding up various objects they have found under controlled archaeological circumstances, of course, and this gentleman is holding up 2 pieces of ceramic pipe, as you can very, very clearly see one with a nozzle. You might call it a male and a female end.

00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:36.000
And it's.

00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:37.000
Captioned.

00:43:37.000 --> 00:43:39.000
Roman water pipe.

00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:42.000
Unfortunately, that's before.

00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:46.000
The uh. The controlling archaeologist got his hands on it because it isn't.

00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:49.000
What they, in fact are.

00:43:49.000 --> 00:43:52.000
These.

00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:54.000
Tubilai.

00:43:54.000 --> 00:43:55.000
Now.

00:43:55.000 --> 00:43:56.000
Jubil.

00:43:56.000 --> 00:44:04.000
TULI uh fired ceramic pipes lock into each other.

00:44:04.000 --> 00:44:07.000
That form the vaulted roof.

00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:09.000
Over the bathhouse.

00:44:09.000 --> 00:44:12.000
And carry hot gases.

00:44:12.000 --> 00:44:13.000
Through the walls.

00:44:13.000 --> 00:44:15.000
And over the vault.

00:44:15.000 --> 00:44:18.000
Over the top of the bathhouse itself.

00:44:18.000 --> 00:44:22.000
So not only is the floor mighty hot beneath your feet.

00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:28.000
The walls are radiating heat, and indeed the vaulted roof is radiating heat as well.

00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:32.000
So this is a bathhouse. It's very efficient. Uses.

00:44:32.000 --> 00:44:34.000
All the thermal properties.

00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:39.000
From the furnaces to get every possible surface jolly, warm.

00:44:39.000 --> 00:44:51.000
And in December or January or February, on the edge of the end of Western Hadrian's wall, with Atlantic storms and gales coming in, you can think how very, very nice and cosy indeed.

00:44:51.000 --> 00:44:55.000
But this particular form of the use of tubuli.

00:44:55.000 --> 00:44:58.000
And vaulted roofs like this.

00:44:58.000 --> 00:45:01.000
Is specific to North Africa.

00:45:01.000 --> 00:45:06.000
Libya, Tunisia, and to the Near East.

00:45:06.000 --> 00:45:07.000
Jordan.

00:45:07.000 --> 00:45:08.000
Israel.

00:45:08.000 --> 00:45:10.000
Palestine, that area.

00:45:10.000 --> 00:45:11.000
Now.

00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:13.000
This means we have to go back.

00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:16.000
To the raison d'etre for the bathhouse.

00:45:16.000 --> 00:45:18.000
Whose plan.

00:45:18.000 --> 00:45:22.000
The moment looks something along these sort of lines.

00:45:22.000 --> 00:45:30.000
But these are mostly the robbing out trenches from these big load, bearing walls.

00:45:30.000 --> 00:45:31.000
Now it's important to remember.

00:45:31.000 --> 00:45:36.000
That the Emperor Septimia Severus came from Libya.

00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:40.000
He came from Lepsis magna, indeed, on the Libyan shoreline.

00:45:40.000 --> 00:45:44.000
And his wife, Julia Domnier, was actually from Syria.

00:45:44.000 --> 00:45:48.000
So they're bringing a whole.

00:45:48.000 --> 00:45:52.000
North African Slash, Middle Eastern flavor.

00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:59.000
To their presence in Britain and their Cabinet and their core to their senior military officers. Around them.

00:45:59.000 --> 00:46:03.000
Now, this isn't by any means a full plan. Clearly.

00:46:03.000 --> 00:46:09.000
The size of the bar. Fallacy is greater than the area of the trench at present.

00:46:09.000 --> 00:46:12.000
And the end of this season.

00:46:12.000 --> 00:46:15.000
The director there is actually giving a site tour.

00:46:15.000 --> 00:46:24.000
And you can see the P. Lie standing up on that surface. So the actual floor was at this level on top up here.

00:46:24.000 --> 00:46:30.000
And all these trenches full of water, cause it didn't have rain this spring. Are the rubber trenches.

00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:34.000
From the major structural walls.

00:46:34.000 --> 00:46:43.000
Of the bathhouse. Now this, this bathhouse would have had very big chunky walls indeed to support its size and weight.

00:46:43.000 --> 00:46:54.000
Not even sure that any of the walls they've got in the trench are external walls. I think these are mostly internal walls. So this is a small cross wall. Here.

00:46:54.000 --> 00:46:57.000
There's the remaining bit of a wall foundation.

00:46:57.000 --> 00:47:01.000
This rubber trench is removed all the way along here.

00:47:01.000 --> 00:47:06.000
And all the black, ashy material, of course, is the ashes.

00:47:06.000 --> 00:47:09.000
From the furnaces that the whole bathhouse was heated with.

00:47:09.000 --> 00:47:15.000
And, as you can see, it's a very big hole. There's the modern surface today.

00:47:15.000 --> 00:47:19.000
And there's the director's head. So he's on the.

00:47:19.000 --> 00:47:21.000
Standing on a surface.

00:47:21.000 --> 00:47:24.000
Inside the bathhouse floor.

00:47:24.000 --> 00:47:27.000
And the floor over here would have been a slightly higher level.

00:47:27.000 --> 00:47:30.000
With his ply, raising the floor.

00:47:30.000 --> 00:47:33.000
So all this has been exposed.

00:47:33.000 --> 00:47:37.000
Because of the Cricket Club's new pavilion that's going to be built there.

00:47:37.000 --> 00:47:38.000
And.

00:47:38.000 --> 00:47:51.000
This massive robbing exercise, removing huge tunnels of Pre cut stone from the Roman building to Bill Carlyle Cathedral, and indeed the walls around Carlisle.

00:47:51.000 --> 00:47:54.000
Hence the walls are negatives.

00:47:54.000 --> 00:47:56.000
The ready, the medieval robbers.

00:47:56.000 --> 00:48:03.000
Didn't, however, have a use for irregularly shaped blocks like these 2.

00:48:03.000 --> 00:48:09.000
No, I don't mean Alice. Uh! What I mean are these 2 extraordinary pieces of sculpture.

00:48:09.000 --> 00:48:14.000
Which have been rejected by the medieval robbers.

00:48:14.000 --> 00:48:20.000
The reason they've been rejected, of course, is you can't build a castle out of irregular pieces of stone like this.

00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:24.000
This is the local red Penrith sandstone.

00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:26.000
And they are.

00:48:26.000 --> 00:48:29.000
Over lifes, sculptural figures.

00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:32.000
Of theatrical.

00:48:32.000 --> 00:48:36.000
Heads there, rather red Indian sort of look about.

00:48:36.000 --> 00:48:37.000
So.

00:48:37.000 --> 00:48:50.000
Professor Alice here is modeling them, as you can see, for the Digging Britain series. This is the site director in the middle here, and they're whacking great things, and they are protective.

00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:55.000
They are part of the sculptural decoration that would have been high on the walls.

00:48:55.000 --> 00:48:58.000
Of the bathhouse, and.

00:48:58.000 --> 00:49:03.000
Giving a deity protection over the whole of the building.

00:49:03.000 --> 00:49:06.000
Because let's face it. You're very vulnerable.

00:49:06.000 --> 00:49:15.000
When you're wearing nothing but your skin and your fingering, and you've just discovered the gems dropped out, of course. Thus they are a protective.

00:49:15.000 --> 00:49:23.000
Piece of art that would have been high up on the building, so we could only reconstruct the building really from the architectural.

00:49:23.000 --> 00:49:28.000
Pieces that have been left behind, that the medieval robbers left.

00:49:28.000 --> 00:49:31.000
So the site.

00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:33.000
Last week was back, filled again.

00:49:33.000 --> 00:49:42.000
So here is the surface of those Roman floors. These blooming great water filled holes here because it rained this spring quite a lot.

00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:51.000
There's 1 of the walls Print Cross section which occupied the trench which has been robbed through here, and the other one up through the top. There.

00:49:51.000 --> 00:49:57.000
So you can see it is deep. There's the modern surface today, protective.

00:49:57.000 --> 00:50:05.000
Sheeting has been laid over, runners to be delicate areas of ply, and so on, and for safety reasons alone it has to be backfilled.

00:50:05.000 --> 00:50:18.000
There is a lottery funded scheme, I think, to continue the excavation. I don't know how many years more, but next summer I guess that'll all come out again, and it's all illustrating one.

00:50:18.000 --> 00:50:20.000
Major, facet.

00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:29.000
Of Roman history in this country, and that is the Emperor Septimi of Severus, with a very large army, we think of about 40,000 troops.

00:50:29.000 --> 00:50:30.000
Turning up in Britain.

00:50:30.000 --> 00:50:33.000
Basing himself in York.

00:50:33.000 --> 00:50:43.000
And then campaigning in the North, including building great new bathhouses here at Stan X. For his.

00:50:43.000 --> 00:50:46.000
Ah! 1,000 strong, cavalry regiment.

00:50:46.000 --> 00:50:52.000
And all the places with these white blocks are known to have been occupied.

00:50:52.000 --> 00:50:58.000
Or reoccupied during the period of Severuses and his son Carracol.

00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:00.000
Campaigns in the North.

00:51:00.000 --> 00:51:04.000
The reason he came here to campaign in North was.

00:51:04.000 --> 00:51:07.000
That he was a very successful military general.

00:51:07.000 --> 00:51:12.000
From Uh, who was governor of the area that is today. Romania.

00:51:12.000 --> 00:51:26.000
And he wanted himself a nice, cheap, easy victory. So going and attacking Scotland beyond the Hadrian's wall beyond the ant wall as well, would give him a cheapish, easy victory.

00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:29.000
Uh, you'll notice we have naval support.

00:51:29.000 --> 00:51:35.000
Coming up here with the Roman navy involved as well, and coming up the coast of Fife.

00:51:35.000 --> 00:51:40.000
The campaign was ultimately successful, and fortunately um.

00:51:40.000 --> 00:51:43.000
Uh. Severus died in York in 2, 11.

00:51:43.000 --> 00:51:55.000
His 2 sons, Geita and Caracala, then died for the Emperor. Shiplla murdered his brother Gita, and then took over as one of the most.

00:51:55.000 --> 00:52:04.000
Dreadful Emperor's Rome's ever seen. Never mind, he did build a huge bath house, of course, in Rome the passive. So this.

00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:15.000
Not very well known. Campaign by Severus in Scotland, has now got a massive new bathhouse in Carlisle, which is still undergoing excavation.

00:52:15.000 --> 00:52:21.000
And with all the architectural fragments from the excavation. We also have window glass.

00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:31.000
Painted wall plaster. This was a place of enormous sophistication, and classical art is perhaps the best way to describe it.

00:52:31.000 --> 00:52:33.000
For a bunch of.

00:52:33.000 --> 00:52:38.000
I put it not too mildly hairy bottom troops.

00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:41.000
But clearly there's an influence here from North Africa.

00:52:41.000 --> 00:52:53.000
Architecturally, as well as perhaps a hint of imperial visiting to this bathhouse, and some of the other facilities along Hadrian's wall.

00:52:53.000 --> 00:52:55.000
From rich, and Severus.

00:52:55.000 --> 00:53:00.000
Launched his campaign into Scotland. So you can't get much newer than that.

00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:04.000
Uh, because literally the only backfill the trench, I think last week.

00:53:04.000 --> 00:53:13.000
Pending more excavation, probably in the next few years, and I think, so far, 800 volunteers.

00:53:13.000 --> 00:53:17.000
Have participated in the excavate. Carlyle.

00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:18.000
Project.

00:53:18.000 --> 00:53:20.000
Which is brilliant, isn't it?

00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:30.000
So archaeology is alive and well. We see different facets of new information on Roman Britain coming to light and new and different influences.

00:53:30.000 --> 00:53:38.000
Right. I've whiz through that at the rate of not. Thank you, Kay, for that applause through that very quickly, and I hope.

00:53:38.000 --> 00:53:43.000
You've taken up some information I've given you from that.

00:53:43.000 --> 00:53:52.000
All those 3 stories I've shared with you have been in the national media. You've only got to Google them. And look.

00:53:52.000 --> 00:54:04.000
Northern Disney does, or whatever, and you, too, can have an idea of mental play with the objects, and see what you think. It might have been used for, and so on.

00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:12.000
So. Thank you all very much indeed. I'll leave Lauren now to bang a couple of quick questions. Thank you, Sheila, over to you, Lauren.

00:54:12.000 --> 00:54:18.000
Thank you. Thanks so much, Simon. That was so good. I'll like, say, we'll put a couple of questions to you before we finish up.

00:54:18.000 --> 00:54:19.000
Of course.

00:54:19.000 --> 00:54:26.000
And so there was a couple of people asking if you could visit the site there in Carlisle.

00:54:26.000 --> 00:54:27.000
Yeah.

00:54:27.000 --> 00:54:34.000
Well, no cause. He's been backfilled for safety purposes as much as anything else. The last song you want is the police ringing you up and saying, Oh, there's a body in the hole.

00:54:34.000 --> 00:54:37.000
You know some drugs falled in and drowned, or whatever it happens.

00:54:37.000 --> 00:54:40.000
So health and safety means it has to be backfilled.

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:45.000
Flattened completely, and then re excavated. The following year.

00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:47.000
Thank you.

00:54:47.000 --> 00:54:54.000
Um. Another question here. Is it possible to identify specific Roman stones in the castle walls, from from um.

00:54:54.000 --> 00:55:03.000
Yes, it is. There is a very strong suggestion in some of the standing walls in Carlisle today that they are regular.

00:55:03.000 --> 00:55:05.000
Ashlar locks.

00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:16.000
And that's not the norm way of doing things. They are recycled from Roman buildings, and this bathhouse, judging by the size of it, is very obviously one of the major donors.

00:55:16.000 --> 00:55:20.000
So, looking at the walls of the castle, the earliest part of the keep.

00:55:20.000 --> 00:55:26.000
There are big rectangular blocks which are very clearly Roman in origin.

00:55:26.000 --> 00:55:28.000
So yes.

00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:38.000
And one that just came in at the end. There from Valerie was Septimus, the only emperor to go beyond Hadrian's wall, and she hadn't realized that there were so many Roman remains north of Hadrian's Wall.

00:55:38.000 --> 00:55:40.000
Oh, Lord! There are absolutely yes.

00:55:40.000 --> 00:55:48.000
Uh. Many of them are, however, hidden because they are the archaeological remains of Roman timber force.

00:55:48.000 --> 00:55:52.000
From the various different campaigns which took place into Scotland.

00:55:52.000 --> 00:56:07.000
However, there's a bathhouse just outside Glasgow. Up there's Dan. There's a number of fort Installations at Fort, for instance, along the line of the antenn wall, which are upstanding, ruinous, and visible.

00:56:07.000 --> 00:56:12.000
Absolutely. Yes.

00:56:12.000 --> 00:56:13.000
Mm-hmm.

00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:16.000
Um, and just one last one before we wrap up um. So Kathleen asks, how would the edges.

00:56:16.000 --> 00:56:19.000
Who, making the gemstone rings, be able to carve small figures without.

00:56:19.000 --> 00:56:23.000
Oh, right? Yeah, this has always been a bit of a problem.

00:56:23.000 --> 00:56:30.000
Um. The answer is, we think that we're people who were very slightly myopic, or, in fact, quite a lot myopic.

00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:32.000
Probably had a career path.

00:56:32.000 --> 00:56:36.000
In fine close carving work.

00:56:36.000 --> 00:56:37.000
We do not know.

00:56:37.000 --> 00:56:40.000
Of a single lens.

00:56:40.000 --> 00:56:43.000
From the Roman world.

00:56:43.000 --> 00:56:48.000
So unless you use a glass of water, which does act as.

00:56:48.000 --> 00:56:50.000
A lens of sorts.

00:56:50.000 --> 00:56:57.000
Having very, very short sight is a positive in uh um career, plus.

00:56:57.000 --> 00:56:59.000
In the gem carving, industry.

00:56:59.000 --> 00:57:02.000
And clearly there's an awful lot of them.

00:57:02.000 --> 00:57:07.000
From the fortress baths in Caleon. I think it was about.

00:57:07.000 --> 00:57:10.000
45 that came out of the drains. There.

00:57:10.000 --> 00:57:18.000
So, as you can see, this hot water bathing lark is all very well, but you gotta check your personal jewelry afterwards, because.

00:57:18.000 --> 00:57:23.000
You'll very likely be losing a jamstone or 2. I emphasize that there's semi precious.

00:57:23.000 --> 00:57:29.000
They're not precious. They're not. Staff are in this sort of thing, but they are hard stones, agate.

00:57:29.000 --> 00:57:37.000
Uh Jasper Courts. That sort of thing, rock crystal. Some of them are also glass. I should say. They're molded glass.

00:57:37.000 --> 00:57:44.000
So yeah, bit of a bit of a pain when you get out the bath and find oh, hell! It's dropped out.

00:57:44.000 --> 00:57:45.000
But that's the archaeolog.

00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:49.000
Benefit. We get to see that material.

00:57:49.000 --> 00:57:53.000
Now I believe that the though the Tallyhouse Museum in Carlisle.

00:57:53.000 --> 00:58:02.000
Partly shot for refurbishment at the moment. I think there is an exhibition of this material in one of the annexes which is visible.

00:58:02.000 --> 00:58:04.000
So if you phone yourself in Carlisle.

00:58:04.000 --> 00:58:11.000
Well worth getting yourself to the Tolly House Museum and the exhibition therein, which will show you some of this material.

00:58:11.000 --> 00:58:16.000
Taking a hand lanes with you would be a very clever idea.

00:58:16.000 --> 00:58:20.000
Recommended. It's really really nice museum, but.

00:58:20.000 --> 00:58:21.000
It is.

00:58:21.000 --> 00:58:22.000
Yeah.

00:58:22.000 --> 00:58:23.000
So thank you.

00:58:23.000 --> 00:58:24.000
It's super duper.

00:58:24.000 --> 00:58:28.000
Thank you so much, so interesting, judging by the comments here, it's been very well received.

00:58:28.000 --> 00:58:29.000
Um.

00:58:29.000 --> 00:58:40.000
So thank you all very much, and I hope that you enjoyed it, and inspired to find out a bit more just going to stop our recording. Now.

00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:09.000
Right, thank you very much Fiona. Right, can you all see and hear me properly?

00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:10.000
Yes.

00:00:10.000 --> 00:00:13.000
I will attempt the screen share.

00:00:13.000 --> 00:00:16.000
Alright, does that look all right? Yes, go to that one. No? Oh gosh, sorry, wrong button.

00:00:16.000 --> 00:00:21.000
No. Nope.

00:00:21.000 --> 00:00:22.000
Yeah. That's based and if you just pop it onto your slide show mode that would be fantastic.

00:00:22.000 --> 00:00:31.000
Is that better? Pick up up many buttons. Hello. Oh, My nose are in shades already.

00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:39.000
Right, okay, let's see what happens. Oh yeah, yeah, that's good. Well, welcome everybody and thank you for coming along.

00:00:39.000 --> 00:00:54.000
And of course thank you for the invitation me to come and give one of my faith talks to well I don't learn as anyway generally it all comes about partly where I live.

00:00:54.000 --> 00:01:19.000
I live just up the road from the new forest in the cathedral city of and I, I obviously became interested in the new forest simply by being close to it and having this background as Fiona says in environmental science, environmental policy sort of thing, I suddenly realized it all comes together just a cycle ride from where I'm sitting talking to you in quite a large area.

00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:28.000
When we think about, forests. We get so many different images of them. Or ideas in our minds about it.

00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:50.000
I haven't got time obviously to go into them, but when we talk about royal hunting forests or some people prefer the term royal forests because other things as we'll see were done in them apart from from hunting like timber production for example, then we still have a number of images and some are on the on the left of my image there is I think that is from a French medieval manuscript.

00:01:50.000 --> 00:01:51.000
That's some seriously rich people at some point in the high middle ages chasing some poor animal.

00:01:51.000 --> 00:02:21.000
Through the trees, to almost certain death and all the rest of it. Next to that is a photograph taken many years ago of my daughter not looking very happy because he just done an unpleasant exam at school but that is the site or reputed site and no one believes it's the real site of where King William Rufus that's the the son of William the Conqueror.

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Was actually killed. No one quite knows why he was killed, but as you'll see the Normans weren't altogether popular in England.

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So that's, sort of part of the idea of the history of it, but also part of the mythologizing, beneath it, about it.

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Beneath it, of course, that's a little chap underneath, is, that's a little chap underneath, is, one of many images of a green man, a sort of forest entity in mythology, looks a bit like me actually before I shave my beard off.

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And You know, so we got these very deep mythological associations with forests as well, including the new forest.

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I don't really got time to go into that sort of thing. Fascinating though it is because I'm teaching this more or less.

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As an exercise in looking at land use change and economy from a slightly bizarre start. The idea that you could take large chunks of somebody else's country if you concrete and go around hunting in this as well.

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And on the right is a book I produced a few years ago. Now I think, 2,018 is the official public date.

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Publication date called the New Forest, the forging. Of a landscape. And I think, you know, the sense or sending you, information about that as well.

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So the scope of what I'm going to be, talking about today is a little bit by what we understand and mean by royal or just hunting forests if you like or royal forests.

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And then, how we can see them in, in more modern terms, I'll explain what that means in a minute.

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Obviously it's an historic landscape and it's a little bit unusual. In that, most of the rest of England Whyiles and so on.

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Was, covered in a manorial system and that was the system of governance.

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Here you had something else sitting on top of it, which pleased the king and so on. I want to talk to something about the new forest today because you're interested in environmental conservation and policy, it's 1 of our 3 newer national parks in England anyway.

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The other 2 being the Norfolk Broads and the South Downs. And I'll just touch on some issues of woodland management as well because of course, pardon me, I'm just getting over something.

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Because Of course, we are interested not just in the conservation history of them in this day and age, but how we are going to manage looking forward into a time of climate change.

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Now, this is a rather fun map produced in a book by, a source of predecessor of mine at White College, Robin Best.

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It's a very old book and I like using very old diagrams for very old subjects as you can see, but what Robin has produced here, is, just a simple map showing where the, Royal Forest or Royal Hunting Forests were in in in England and the borders of Wales at least over there here and what immediately grabs our attention is the huge amount of land that was

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involved. Now because the areas involved came and went a little bit, you can't give a very definitive percentage, but it's somewhere I think between 20, maybe 25% of the area of England of Wales as we understand it.

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I should say for Scotland, need to say kings and nobles had forests and probably did similar things in them, but the concept in the strict sense of the royal hunting forest I'm going to be talking about today is restricted really to the area where the Normans had most of their suzerenity if that's the right word.

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But look at this one here, this interests me, virtually the whole of the county of Essex, for example, was underneath the Royal Hunting Forest Legislation.

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The new forest to say is in the deep south down here, you you can look across from its shores and see the Isle of Wight.

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It's that far south. But yeah, let's look large swathes of the middle part of England going up to the wash along here.

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If you've got any geological background you might notice the strike of many of the. Geological outcrop sort of follows this to a lesser extent over here towards the West but over here and of course this is also making a statement about the kinds of soils and so on that were often taken over for the royal hunting forest as well spoiler alert it was basically the more rubbish land the very

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very good areas for cultivation of course remained within the manorial system which is still of course was taken over by the Norman's in the time on and fashion for exploitation of the natural resources and PS the people within as well.

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You will have come across probably the term chases as in you chase after an animal. And that is a similar but not such a Draconian thing when a hunting area belonged to the nobles.

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So down here we've got various chases. Cranbourne Chase would be an example where particular Earls or particular bishops would have had that and it's a kind of as it were poor man's royal hunting forest because you've only got one king.

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And so on. The other thing is to realize about it, You know, in your mind, if somebody says Forest, you think a big stand off trees and you also think, about, something possibly a monoculture of those trees.

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Everything's the same as distinct from a woodland which has got a sort of slightly greener sort of environmental, sort of more cuddly image, but a forest, it's a commercial thing if you like or it's a productionist thing and things like that and that's fine that's the modern use of it but it wasn't really the as I say, wasn't really the origin of the term itself.

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So there's your distribution in the 13th century when more or less time of Henry II and so on when more or less No, I wasn't hearing the second.

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Sorry, there, went on. Yes, he was. No, wasn't. No, it's a time after century after that.

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And, Of course. That was the time when there was a maximum extension of these woods as well, which also says a lot of it about the Norman Kings and their succession successors.

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This is a much later, thing itself. This is the new forest, in 1811, I think in a map, that was produced by, by, by, Percival Lewis.

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And that time, you can still see that the interest is there. They've defined an area, which is still under the forest laws.

00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:18.000
And in case you're wondering the new forest is one of only 2 which have not had the authorization legislation.

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Taken away from them. We can map those forests out, the forest to bear and and all these other places that you'll see throughout the kingdom.

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And they're still there physically very often. Savilex another one but at some point they were disasforested which meant that somebody else generally a noble or in the South Napoleonic period when the the Exchequer was after money often things like the the Exmoor Forest in West Somerset.

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Was taken over by Midlands Ironmaster called John Knight. Because he wanted the resources underneath it.

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In fact, that wasn't very successful. And he tried farming on it, which wasn't very good either, which reinforces the point that the old royal forests were really on the poorer type of land themselves.

00:10:04.000 --> 00:10:26.000
Just a nod in the direction of ecology here. This is the, proportion of ancient semi-natural woodland which is a definition which It's some extent we're stuck with, but if you could show that an area of woodland this time, more or less deciduous woods rather than anything else.

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Was in existence about 8,606 1,600 you know just over 400 years ago then, then you can regard that as, as quote, I'm quite ancient woodland.

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There's lots of problems with that. Certainly is more and more archaeology comes to light and we realize they're off and prehistoric system field system sitting underneath them as well.

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And of that ancient, semi natural ecosystem, about 1% of Great Britain is actually part of it.

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And you can, these are obviously southern counties along here, but you see the Hampshire has quite a respectable amount of that because of us overwhelming majority of the new forest sits within the county of Hampshire.

00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:21.000
Now, okay, what does it really mean? If a forest doesn't originally mean you know, great standoff trees, then it of course is a legal definition and like all things documents aren't always preserved in the way they should be.

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The laws that were produced at some point after 1,066, some people think in the 10 eightys, but it's disputed when it was.

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The original document doesn't seem to exist. We have to pick it up from later documents and get a good idea of what it was all about.

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But the forester is an idea of it from the Latin or Norman's French being outside something.

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And I think this probably refers to it being outside the common law. That's a common law to England which developed which was supposed to be common law for everybody except if you lived in a royal forest you were subject to another set of laws as well about which they lots of stories, some are probably more exaggerated than others.

00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:16.000
And it's distinct from silver culture, which is a lovely word. That means a cultivation of trees.

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I still wish we talked about Sylvia culture rather than just forestry because it would have avoided this confusion all the time.

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And there's also a very good website, dated, sorry, date of about forests between about 1,018 and 1850 which picks up the idea of kings hunting in forests from the Anglo-saxon period but of course through to the Norman conquest and so on.

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And you can see that that's from St. John's College Oxford, a project produced a few years ago and it's very informative and it's full of all sorts of definitions.

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Because trust me, mixture of English Latin and Norman French and probably other things if I thought about it.

00:13:01.000 --> 00:13:12.000
The the technical terminology of these, Boris gets rather complicated and it's all because it's all mixed up with the law and the rights and the wrongs of what you can and can't do and so on.

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And here's the 1st one.

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Well, I had to do my O level French twice so that I could get into a university. I wasn't terribly good at it, but I just about remember the word, which obviously comes from there in French or Norman French, which means the green.

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And the, writer Jeffrey Jawser in the 14th century sent up all these characters and he refers to his German forester.

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He's kind of independent. Forrester he's he's employed and paid a salary or something he's not like a a surf tied to the land he says he's a thief of venison that has a abandoned his greedy appetite.

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And all of his old craft but he can keep a forest better than any man. So he's a crafty old devil, he knows his business.

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And his job is to look after the So look after the green. Why? Because that's what animals like to eat.

00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:19.000
And that's just a fairly random picture I use a lot from the new forest. And you can see here that, part of the ecology is it's a de facto re wilding. That's the open forest.

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It's distinct from the enclosed areas. I come to that later. But never nonetheless, that requires the vert.

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Now, we don't have foresters anymore to look after it as such. We have the forestry commission and they will have various plans to look after areas like this as well.

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The venison, I'm terrible on my breeds of deer, but there is one that's probably a red deer there and that of course is the the prime meat and it is said that you know commoners weren't allowed to eat the venison because that was all part of this sort of mystique of being a king or a noble.

00:14:57.000 --> 00:15:12.000
The sort of people would hunt in the royal forests because the king of course when the days particularly when the court was moving around the country would of course often stay within the forest where you had.

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Back here is you had cow farms as well supplying what the Royal Court needed and he go out with these no nobles and he'd hunt these unfortunate beasts and so on itself and then eat them.

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Fortunately now we commoners are allowed to eat venison. You don't have to keep it quiet and shut the door.

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The rest of it you can eat it in public if you so want to I'm pleased to say.

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Now, of course, Here we've got, I was going to try and move this bar without losing you all.

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So wretched news, it's gonna pull it down, yeah, I'll pull it down, there we go.

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This is, from somebody called Orderika Sitalis who is writing in the latter part of the 11th century lived into the 12th century, the time of the real ascendancy of the Norman kings themselves.

00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:12.000
And he's almost certainly, despite his Latin name and Englishman, so he doesn't particularly write like what's going.

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He says, now reader, let me explain why the Boris, have to move this thing as well.

00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:28.000
Now I can't. Now Reader let me explain why the forest is called the new that part of the country had been populous in earlier days and was scattered with hamlets provided support for settlers.

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Amongst the population thoroughly tilled the county of Hampshire so that the Southern District provided the city of Winchester with all kinds of country produce.

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So he's painting a picture here of something that was there before. And was basically nicked by the Norman Kings.

00:16:45.000 --> 00:17:08.000
And he says, of course, he gives us the figure in the next paragraph that more than 60 parishes are forced the peasants to move to other places and replace the men with beasts in the forest so they might hunted the king's content and so on and there he lost his 2 sons Richard of William Rufus who I think in the beginning we saw the iron fighting Victorian thing around the Roofer Stone where he's supposed to

00:17:08.000 --> 00:17:10.000
be killed but probably wasn't. And this was of course taken as a wrath of God against the Normans.

00:17:10.000 --> 00:17:37.000
Because of that. So, there you go. That image was put forward quite early on of the the way that the Norman Kings behaved and this has been both disputed by landscape historians and also in some ways supported because there seems to be some evidence of the abandonment of earlier settlements within the forest area.

00:17:37.000 --> 00:17:54.000
But by. Okay, but biochemists have come up with this data as well. And so that it might have been some and some, but I think I must stress that, oh gosh, this things not working again, hang on.

00:17:54.000 --> 00:18:01.000
I'll put this back, hang on.

00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:08.000
No, he's not working. Okay, I'm going to stop the share. Go, oh dear, sorry, I'm gonna have to go back in again.

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I'm sorry about this.

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Come back now. I may have to go on to this mode actually. I'll see if it works.

00:18:17.000 --> 00:18:27.000
Oops.

00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:31.000
Can you still read that? Okay.

00:18:31.000 --> 00:18:34.000
Yes, you need to pop onto slideshow though, cause it looks quite some long.

00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:42.000
Well, I can, know it's just there's a problem sometimes with with changing them. And let's go into that one and keep our fingers cross.

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It's getting bit old and crotchy like me this thing. Oh, there we are.

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Hey.

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The other thing about it we were interested in governance or I am and how were things done in the past how was the environment managed in the past well it wasn't obviously manage for conservation in anything like the same way, but it could be managed for hunting.

00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:04.000
Manage for natural resources and stuff. And there's a wonderful list here of the types of, officials that you've got within the new forest anyway.

00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:22.000
The, the roles and names vary a little bit for royal forest or all forest but so anyway there's a steward or chief forester that the big week tended to be an honorary sort of senior position within government basically.

00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:31.000
Then you got the foresters themselves who sometimes had powers outside the forest including those to chase after poachers and things like that.

00:19:31.000 --> 00:19:38.000
The verderers who have been reconstituted in the new forest, they were judicial officers.

00:19:38.000 --> 00:19:48.000
And they still exist, the regard or regard as check for illegal encroachments and reports back. Okay, I'll report to Paxil's back spelling state then report back.

00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:55.000
They had to look out for people hacking up bits of the forest to put little patches of farmland on and things like that.

00:19:55.000 --> 00:20:03.000
Yeah, agisters were related to grazing and received an accounted for the money paid and the heritage and panicked the King's domain land.

00:20:03.000 --> 00:20:08.000
So, you know, they had to make sure they're getting their revenue for it. We're building up a picture here.

00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:10.000
The wood was looked after the woods and the vert, in a, a, sort of manual practical way.

00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:34.000
And the reason I've made a thing about number 7 and put new preservators actually date from tutor times the time of the Elizabeth 1st sort of later 16th century and they had their origin not in the crown or with the crowd but in the Okay.

00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:48.000
And it was the tools drive towards the production of wood within the forests, okay? Their whole idea of kings going out there and hunting, you know, was being laid to rest as it were.

00:20:48.000 --> 00:21:03.000
And we'll see in a minute how Elizabeth 1st herself. Actually showed an interest in the management of woods to something other a purpose other than hunting or anything like that.

00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:16.000
And we get from earlier than Elizabeth the 1st 1547 we get the court of general surveyors And these kinds of institutions become what we later though as the the office of Woods and then the Forestry Commission as well.

00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:28.000
So don't think that all of our modern institutions just sort of date from the 19th and 20th century, many do, like the environment agency, I mean that dates from my lifetime in your lifetime probably.

00:21:28.000 --> 00:21:33.000
But nonetheless, you can immediately see problems arising here.

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The, the, IM, and that is the, the division of powers that really means. And that means that the division of powers that really means.

00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:49.000
And that means that the Exchequer, as in the Chancellor of Exchequer today, could the interests of the forest.

00:21:49.000 --> 00:21:54.000
The historic ones go back ultimately to the Norman Kings as the Lord Morden and things like that.

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It's much more feudal in that respect. His duty was just to preserve the game.

00:21:59.000 --> 00:22:06.000
And in 1542 management of crown was for timber was formalized and they caught created the courts of survivors.

00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:20.000
Of the Kingswood. That's a bit of a giveaway as well. And then of course the objective itself was the commercial function, commercial function of crown woodlands under the direction of the crown itself.

00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:39.000
Now I'm not going to go through this any great detail, but a forestry colleague of mine used to make a big point talking about this act of 1544 and he claimed quite rightly this was the 1st act of parliament what's to do with managing the forests and woods for their own sake and not for hunting or any other purpose itself.

00:22:39.000 --> 00:23:00.000
And indeed coppice management, you don't know what copies management is, it's when you can chop down a broadly tree to sort of ankle or knee height and it will regrow and you get these poles that come up and you cut those poles off again 5 1015 years later depending on how thick you want them from what purpose you can use and typically for fencing or anything else.

00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:09.000
So, Queen Bess is sort of saying, let's put these to some use. Let's get some wood out of it that we can, they use them.

00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:29.000
And she's talking about charcoal. Fuel I should say, fence steaks and house repairs, okay, demand for large timber trees, not apparently there at that time, but you look at historic woodland management they have these standard trees which are the big ones that stand up in the middle are often used for larger constructing purposes as well.

00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:39.000
The origin of copacing may actually be the exploitation of the underwood. That is people opportunistically taking trees out realizing they could grow again.

00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:53.000
And there is a record amongst of Beaulieu Abbey which is on the south side of the forest that sitting Lord Montague of Beauty's state originally it was monastery, They're recorded as managing copies themselves.

00:23:53.000 --> 00:23:59.000
And also something else, certain enclosures, we spell it with an eye. This is not just classic cook spelling.

00:23:59.000 --> 00:24:15.000
This is authentic spelling. Closures especially the Bentley's which is near a place called Frithm have irregular outlines that are possibly a sign of earlier enclosures, which these things have developed rather more organically, the sort of rather ragged edges to them.

00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:19.000
It's not like a square enclosed field or anything like that. And there's a sign here that they are a part of earlier enclosure.

00:24:19.000 --> 00:24:39.000
So there's a lot more going on there and coppicing or ancient wooden may go back a long time and here's a sort of photo montage with the sorts of things that were going on this is actually wood in Kent I didn't tell you that this lovely bluebell workwood near Ash Ash Ashford where I used to live.

00:24:39.000 --> 00:24:48.000
And you can see here these have been copied. These are technically known copy stools chopped out chopped down to a low level and allowed to grow up.

00:24:48.000 --> 00:25:03.000
That one's probably hasn't been chopped for 1015 years something like that. Sometimes these things or often these things have just been left to rip but historically they were being in compartments and they would have logically cleared them at time and time again after 5, 10 years, whatever it was, and let them grow up again, so got a new crop of wood.

00:25:03.000 --> 00:25:08.000
There's of course a boar, very happily, an ancestor of the modern pig going around foraging in the woods there.

00:25:08.000 --> 00:25:22.000
That's probably a standard tree we got there. Yeah, that's an example of Wattle from the Singleton Open Air Museum in Sussex.

00:25:22.000 --> 00:25:33.000
Example of a typical thing when you had to produce your own woods within the manner or within the world forest to around your house or what have you.

00:25:33.000 --> 00:25:44.000
And you can see here that how these things were used. Because finally at the bottom is an example of charcoal making which is still carries on in some in some ancient woods today but not so much in the new forest.

00:25:44.000 --> 00:26:07.000
Compassing is now very limited, the new forest itself. Here's Frithm, the whole village itself, or Hamlet really itself, has this irregular outline there, which suggests this time people settle in Little Valley here where maybe the sores are a little bit richer and we're allowed to farm and graze animals and you get this sense of moving out from a central core and hacking

00:26:07.000 --> 00:26:32.000
away at bits of the forest like that probably in late Saxon times and certainly it would have been controlled at some point because beyond it you've got the Bentley enclosures which are also irregular in our in outline and will have developed as copies enclosures as I suggested these 2 down here but when we use the But enclosure like this.

00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:40.000
These are much more modern, areas where you typically will have things like oaken beach trees and I will talk about that in due course as well.

00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:46.000
So we can begin to look at the structure of the forest and how it's how it works.

00:26:46.000 --> 00:27:02.000
Right, this is, an example of the areas that the new forest has back i think in the sixties from a book by Colin Tubbs, a very excellent book.

00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:12.000
He was the natural England or was then I think Nature Conservancies, Nature Conservancy Council's officer for the new, for the new forest area.

00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:19.000
And you can see here that we've got areas of selvicultural enclosures, there you are with that diagonal hashing there and so on.

00:27:19.000 --> 00:27:22.000
Enclosed freehold lands and crown owned agricultural era. So bits of it have fallen into 3 hand particular, a freehold of month, and things like that.

00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:42.000
Unenclosed broadly, woodland like my slide can occur virtually anywhere and then the perambulation of it because boundaries are very important if you're using legal definitions and every so often if you read these to the new Boris they do a perambulation every 50 or 100 years to just work out what the legal limits of it were.

00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:51.000
This area here from 1,204 is Beaulieu. This was handed over to the monks of Beaulieu Abbey for whatever reason.

00:27:51.000 --> 00:28:06.000
Probably. It is often said that, rampaging armies and things like that were less inclined to go across a domestic land.

00:28:06.000 --> 00:28:17.000
I'm not so convinced by that, but certainly the idea of the King wanting him to be remembered in their prayers and things like that certainly would have played a role in that as well.

00:28:17.000 --> 00:28:26.000
This is just, an example of the, SIs here and the special areas of conservation.

00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:31.000
This is a modern view of it. Looking at the cousin conservation designations that are within it as well.

00:28:31.000 --> 00:28:41.000
And this area is now outside the perambulation of New Forest itself. It's now part of the South Hampshire coastal area.

00:28:41.000 --> 00:28:47.000
I would like to hope one day that there will be a national park that actually stretches pretty well along the Hampshire Dorset coast.

00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:55.000
It's not happened yet. Talked about as well. I mentioned Chase is up here as a Cranbourne Chase and the Wiltshire Downs and so on.

00:28:55.000 --> 00:29:05.000
Also, common land was available. Common land, as you probably know, are areas where people with rights called commoners can graze their animals.

00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:11.000
That is controlled. It doesn't mean anybody can go and graze an animal there. That that's a common myth.

00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:23.000
But people have common rights, can, can, can, can, it as well and they're common as within the forest but also commoners on the outside or commons on the outside and here they're numbered Rockford Common, I know these areas.

00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:28.000
Sadly, actually, there is a conservation problem with many of them. It is difficult to get.

00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:32.000
This poll quality lad to get graziers on them as well and they tend to be scrubbing up quite badly, which is a great chain, but that's part of the landscape history as well.

00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:45.000
There's common as rights within the forest and there comes on the outside the forest as well. About 2324 of them in total.

00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:51.000
So let's just have a look at a few pictures now.

00:29:51.000 --> 00:30:00.000
There's a mosaic of land covers, okay? And this can be related to obviously to management and also to some extent to the legal system that created them.

00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:05.000
The woods as enclosures.

00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:26.000
Talk more about that in a minute, but if you put a fence of some sort or a addiction offense around an area of woods you want to control the animals getting into it typically sometimes you want to you allow the pigs in there but you don't allow the deer in there and that's sort of thing and these enclosures are very important in the history of certainly the later history of the new forest itself.

00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:41.000
Wood pasture anybody's ever heard of the friend only and Prince, that sounds fair. The Dutch ecologist France Vera will know something about Vera's ideas of the wild would and how it was cleared and the role of big grazing animals within it itself.

00:30:41.000 --> 00:30:55.000
Now Vera did a lot of his his work ecologically. In the new forest, came over and studied it, was quite taken by it and he identified it quite correctly.

00:30:55.000 --> 00:31:03.000
It's 1 of the largest areas of wood pasture in in Europe. By that we mean most of it's grazed, but there are trees left there.

00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:18.000
As I said, there were standard trees in Coppice Woodland, so there are wood pastures, grazing underneath, no smaller trees but there are large trees there and a lot of our common land anyway would have been like that in the middle ages and probably just after.

00:31:18.000 --> 00:31:26.000
Because you can grace your animals on the common underneath them, but you can also chop bowels and things off them for fuel or more like for construction and things like that.

00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:34.000
So it's a dual land use. Heaths of course tend to be on poorer land with heat plants, ericas and so on.

00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:56.000
Grasslands we know what that is. Myers and bugs, the new forest Scotland by the Well, by the hectare, pools, which of course are often what we call technically perched water table areas, like little, little, sometimes ephemeral but little to pumps and things like that and lawns which have often been and nibbled by 1st of all by animals then later by rabbits so they

00:31:56.000 --> 00:32:10.000
look like a sort of golf course in tea off on a golf course or something like that but they're of ecological importance and then a designation which dates I think from the 18th century the ancient and ornamental woodlands certainly the Boulder would drive and places like that within the new forest.

00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:25.000
Are about that and that's was reckoned by Colin Tabs to be one of the few specific ecological ecosystems ecosystems ecological definitions which actually appears in modern statutory law as such.

00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:37.000
And so This is of course gives us a clue. Now if you're a keen gardener unless you really liked Alpines or something you wouldn't buy a house with a garden like this this is typical of some of the plateau gravels that we get in the new forest.

00:32:37.000 --> 00:32:48.000
So it gives us immediately a clue as to why the Norman Kings decided to take this for hunting.

00:32:48.000 --> 00:33:02.000
And not establish a manner on it. Remember the advantages of having a manor is you got agricultural produce coming off it you've got possibility of course of raising armies under pure feudalism from where their peasants and and taxes can be gathered as well.

00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:11.000
Royal hunting for us did have the manorial system in but it was a bit muted and it sat there underneath the forest law itself.

00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:22.000
So you can see why this would have been a classic area where he would have allowed or wanted the royal hunting forest to develop itself.

00:33:22.000 --> 00:33:29.000
And you can see here that the vegetation has gone up, this course there, there's bits and pieces of Heather and so on.

00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:34.000
This is wood pasture. Note the beautiful grazing line under there. Produced by the tallest animals.

00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:39.000
They'd be new forest ponies of course as you know as small ponies. Used to be rather cruelly said I think to a coal mines and things like that they now they've much happier lives.

00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:52.000
Also cattle are out there larger horses are out there and so on. So this is your typical wood pasture type of cover as well.

00:33:52.000 --> 00:34:00.000
Because of the geology you get, impermeable layers even, under the gravels and under the sandstones and things.

00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:04.000
So you will see that water will accumulate on the surface. And again, this is not desirable for conventional agriculture.

00:34:04.000 --> 00:34:11.000
Wouldn't really bother to plough that up and plant wheat on it unless you were need of help I think.

00:34:11.000 --> 00:34:20.000
Here is an enclosure with an old wood bank on it as well. Holly action is quite common there.

00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:26.000
The trees would tend to be. Yes, things like oak, oaken beach.

00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:35.000
So that's a broad leaf enclosure with the bank. There you've got coniferization, although that's actually ironically enough, those are broad leaf trees.

00:34:35.000 --> 00:34:42.000
Coniferization, which I'll come back to later, that's the replacement of the historic hardwood forests, with, Call it first, st which has got a much more market value today.

00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:50.000
Certainly for building purposes and things like that. Artificial drainage, that's interesting in itself.

00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:56.000
Because a lot of that dates in the 19th century and now they're stopping it now and they're bringing areas of wet and back by simply clogging up these drains.

00:34:56.000 --> 00:35:07.000
All the rest of it, but you don't need to be an engineer or a hydrologist to see that is man-made in order to encourage the growth of these these trees here as well.

00:35:07.000 --> 00:35:15.000
Well there's a mire or a pool if you like. For it's as well. These are a bit ephemeral, walking off of peace as it were in the new forest in the winter.

00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:31.000
Is a lot more tricky. And lot more in need of welly boots and care than it is in the summer because of the fluctuating water tables and things coming up there.

00:35:31.000 --> 00:35:42.000
That's a lawn going down my nice little stream there with a bridge and of course those sorts of areas are these days used because it's open access obviously for people to go have their picnics and children to play in and things like that.

00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:58.000
So, you know, the mosaic of land usage has modern uses, modern references itself. Oh, this is just a very fine shot of the head of there with some rather invasive gorse coming in as well.

00:35:58.000 --> 00:36:04.000
Probably taken in the autumn. Do that you'll be familiar with P. Heath and has a cycle and has to be managed, particularly, it will go to SIM essence and start falling over and all the rest of it.

00:36:04.000 --> 00:36:25.000
The classic ways of managing Heathman here and elsewhere are either to cut it which is probably the safest way to graze it but that has problems after the certain level of maturity of it or to burn it, which of course has lots of risks and in fact heathland fires in Hampshire.

00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:40.000
Dorset a yearly occurrence. Which keeps the local fire brigades. Sort of rather busy actually and lots of warnings for people these days not particularly to have these little barbecuees and then treat them in response because that's a common source of it as well.

00:36:40.000 --> 00:37:00.000
But in a controlled way that could be the management, they heat them as well. So you you need the heat of the certain level for it to behave and in other contexts not so much a new price of course it provides cover for for shooting and things like that.

00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:26.000
I mentioned the commoners rights as well. Common is rights are sort of evolved and in 1217 there was something produced which was called the Charter of the Forest just after the time of Magnet Carter and that actually among a lot of other things talked about protecting the rights of the commoners, these are ancient rights, they're certain little gone back to Anglo Saxon times before the Normans took over.

00:37:26.000 --> 00:37:33.000
And the people who still live within the forest had the right to turbulent to take turns for fuel, mal to take soil for marling land.

00:37:33.000 --> 00:37:38.000
Well I wouldn't take anything for a new forest from my car really. It's all very nutrient poor.

00:37:38.000 --> 00:37:49.000
Estovas the right to take sufficient woods to the commoners house. If you had those commoners rights you could take it and you could burn it in your cottage and things like that.

00:37:49.000 --> 00:37:56.000
But if you took too much control to sell it, tried to sell it, it was controlled so you get into trouble.

00:37:56.000 --> 00:38:09.000
Your mask is the right to turn pigs out and then of course the, the grazing, the right to If you'll be familiar this through past year, cattle horses and sheep and other animals on the common land.

00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:15.000
Now, Oops, let's just try and get this out of the way again.

00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:28.000
The LG of enclosure then, which is the idea that comes in much later, states from the end of the, 17th century, the increase in preservation of timber in the new forest.

00:38:28.000 --> 00:38:49.000
And, It was said that during the English Civil War period the forest forests had been rather neglected because of course it was the only time that England had an experiment with republicanism but that was probably largely due to Samuel peeps it was a bit of a royalist on the side but anyway they were thinking about it for reasons I'll come to in a little while.

00:38:49.000 --> 00:38:53.000
As to, produce, from enclosed areas of woods proper commercial hardwood forestry.

00:38:53.000 --> 00:39:06.000
I think hard and forestry a stress oak majority in some beach were was very popular as well. And there's all sorts of controls.

00:39:06.000 --> 00:39:22.000
New pollards, that's trees that are cut at a higher level, very common in our towns these and days because of course they didn't want polys they wanted whole trees and so it became illegal to start new poll building whether they actually did or not I don't know.

00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:28.000
So the state is moving in and we're getting woodland management occurring as well. And this is a long time after Queen Bess.

00:39:28.000 --> 00:39:37.000
Well with her coppicing act as Coppice is reckoned to have failed actually. Here. But never mind, there's other things I wanted to do with it.

00:39:37.000 --> 00:39:42.000
Every time I do that, I can't move it down. I'm so sorry. Hang on.

00:39:42.000 --> 00:39:49.000
Yeah, okay, stop, share. I'm going to come back in a minute. There we are.

00:39:49.000 --> 00:39:53.000
Right.

00:39:53.000 --> 00:40:02.000
Right, let's carry on to where I have.

00:40:02.000 --> 00:40:13.000
It's past all the pickies.

00:40:13.000 --> 00:40:23.000
So, the next subject then is the the rise of scientific, oh gosh, sorry. That's it, that's working.

00:40:23.000 --> 00:40:35.000
The rise of scientific forestry. I haven't got time to go into this now. But you'll see that from the 18th century, particularly the 5th report when they were worried about 2 things.

00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:43.000
One was the forest was underproducing and that meant unproducing, wood ultimately for the Navy.

00:40:43.000 --> 00:40:57.000
And underproduced and overproducing corruption really. There lots of room for corruption with all these officials kicking around that they tried to do so they started to promote things like things like, Noeries for the trees.

00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:07.000
And then eventually this would lead to the rise of, the Office of Woods being in control and the forestry commission as well.

00:41:07.000 --> 00:41:12.000
John Evelyn and John Manwood, he been wrote about forest trees. Manwood did an early example to try and encapsulate the idea of the forest laws itself.

00:41:12.000 --> 00:41:21.000
So you got the 2 sides of the royal forest here, trees and the forest. Laws themselves.

00:41:21.000 --> 00:41:33.000
One looking forward and one looking backwards. About this time, I'll be the late 17, th early 18th century or later 18th century that they're really looking at turning into something else like that.

00:41:33.000 --> 00:41:45.000
One of the events, of course, that changed the interest in it was the Dutch came up the River Medway in 1,667 and burnt the Royal Navy.

00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:54.000
Now this is probably worth one of the most, embarrassing episodes in British, naval or British military history generally.

00:41:54.000 --> 00:41:57.000
And I used to live in this area, so I've been to the Chat and Label.

00:41:57.000 --> 00:42:10.000
Docyards and I know a bit about this. And the person who changed it changed the idea of the King was of course Samuel Peep, who was a civil servant at the time and an MP and he petitioned that we should rebuild the Navy.

00:42:10.000 --> 00:42:14.000
And from 1,684 we rebuilt the Navy. Well, from 1,684 we rebuilt the Navy.

00:42:14.000 --> 00:42:15.000
Well, you got to have ships, the Royal Hunting Forest, but particularly the New Forest, were a good center for this.

00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:27.000
The new forest is well positioned for it because you've got the Solent, you've got the English Channel nearby and you can produce historic, shipyards there as well.

00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:38.000
So you can actually build ship ships there right at JSON to your resource for it as well. This is the 5th report.

00:42:38.000 --> 00:42:45.000
Now just a little bit on the later use of the forest themselves was a few ones which are bit weird.

00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:50.000
One was 1,851 was the deer removal act which didn't work. The idea that protect the forestry and the commoners rights you took the deer out.

00:42:50.000 --> 00:42:59.000
Now the idea of taking the deer out to Norman King would have been total anathema but there you go.

00:42:59.000 --> 00:43:06.000
And then in 1887 after the pressure of the commoners, rolling enclosure ceased.

00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:19.000
They, they fossilized as it were the areas which were enclosed for timber production for the Navy and they didn't need it anymore because from about 1,840 he started to have ironclad battleships.

00:43:19.000 --> 00:43:35.000
So the forest has has moved again. Now I'm gonna have to move on a little bit, I think because of the time, but I wanted to just note here from the, certainly the middle part of the 19th century with the office of wood is moving in and it is producing conifers.

00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:50.000
These are supposed needles at the expense of the forests there of the broadly for themselves. And, the sorts of things that happen when you put,

00:43:50.000 --> 00:44:04.000
You put. Sorry. Yeah, that you put carnivorous is is it starts to use more water it stops the recharge of the soil and the water running through to the rivers and things like that.

00:44:04.000 --> 00:44:11.000
So there are environmental problems with this as well and this is going to be a bigger problem with climate change as well.

00:44:11.000 --> 00:44:27.000
Another thing here is If you're looking generally to restore ancient woodland habitats rather than just leave everything to go under commercial forestry, this is an example from Scotland where they've mapped out where the potential is.

00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:33.000
For putting back ancient woods ancient forests and the Caledonian forest is a wonderful star in itself.

00:44:33.000 --> 00:44:40.000
I was visiting this part of the world only a few years ago and and and the Lockheed.

00:44:40.000 --> 00:44:50.000
National Nature Reserve up here is wonderful. It's got a bit of the historic forest left, but I digress a little bit, but I'm saying that we can look intelligently at forests, we don't need to use it all for coniferous.

00:44:50.000 --> 00:45:02.000
We can bring back the ancient woods or the ancient forest and of course the conifers up here the scots pine clue in the name is of course native to Scotland but not the new forest so you can think in intelligently about this.

00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:20.000
But we've now got the National Park, of course. And this dates from I think about 2 2 yes 25 and although we got an ancient system of governments linked originally to the the royal hunting for us.

00:45:20.000 --> 00:45:31.000
We've now got a national park there and we can control visitor management we control planning within it and we can look at you hopefully holistically at its management as well.

00:45:31.000 --> 00:45:39.000
So here's a little bit of a. A sort of a synthesis of what I've said.

00:45:39.000 --> 00:45:44.000
Norman Kings like did what they like but a manorial life in the Boris continued.

00:45:44.000 --> 00:45:55.000
Henry the second the mid 12th century sorry about getting his data on earlier is enthusiastic for more of forestation just to show how powerful he was Henry was a bit like that.

00:45:55.000 --> 00:46:08.000
Magna Carta Charter of the Forest guarantees the rights for forest dwellers. The ancient hierarchy which was well intended and changed of course is the treasury moved in with the preservatives but produced corrupt officials.

00:46:08.000 --> 00:46:17.000
That, that was a 2 sits lines of command really. That came in, a producing the Division Imperium.

00:46:17.000 --> 00:46:22.000
That was going to be the crown versus the Exchequer or the Crown versus the state interest.

00:46:22.000 --> 00:46:46.000
Replanting for the Navy comes in big time. TGIC importance, the state gets involved here, loss of markets for timber, the 19th century we move over to producing a lot of softwood trees a lot of cometh because you can sell that my son is a carpenter he will tell you all about what you need and he would be a little bit less happy perhaps about working with hardwoods in building construction than he

00:46:46.000 --> 00:46:52.000
would obviously with softwoods and things like that. But there still remains a struggle to maintain grazing by common commoners and this becomes a conservation issue.

00:46:52.000 --> 00:47:04.000
Right, here we go. I'm going to stop sharing and Fiona hopefully will have some questions for me.

00:47:04.000 --> 00:47:10.000
Hi, I certainly do. Thank you very much for that. Here, Jim, we got through quite a lot there, didn't we?

00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:17.000
Right, okay, I'm just going to crack straight on with some questions. I'm just going to start from the top.

00:47:17.000 --> 00:47:27.000
No, from Jan. You talked right at the start about almost like the whole of Essex coming under the forest legislation.

00:47:27.000 --> 00:47:32.000
Jan's asking how far did the Forest of Essex come into London?

00:47:32.000 --> 00:47:34.000
Well, I mean, London was confined within Middlesex, in, in those days.

00:47:34.000 --> 00:47:53.000
So it's it's a little bit of a difficult question to answer but things like Epping Forest if that's what she's thinking about was, things like Epping Forest, if that's what she's thinking about, was part of, if that's what she's thinking about, was part of, of the Forest of Essex.

00:47:53.000 --> 00:47:58.000
In fact, another talk I give, I talk a little bit about this. And in fact, how they were different.

00:47:58.000 --> 00:48:06.000
Actually involved within it. But there was a big time for memory of disaporstation quite early on actually in the forest of Essex.

00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:10.000
I mean That's what I thought, 13, th 13th century, something like I can't remember.

00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:24.000
And there's another interesting thing about how through Octavia Hills and other people it comes to be part of the areas really for for public enjoyment particularly of London as as London was growing so it's a nice question

00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:26.000
Okay, thank you. And There we go, Jan. I hope that was some way to answering your question.

00:48:26.000 --> 00:48:40.000
Another question from Margaret. She understands that there were forest prisons

00:48:40.000 --> 00:48:45.000
And she's asking, why did these come into being? If that's right.

00:48:45.000 --> 00:49:05.000
Well, like any other prison for miscreants, I think she might be thinking of the blind house, which from memory I think is in Lindhurst, it's possibly called the Blind House because there weren't any windows in it rather than sort of the idea that they could put your eyes out for poaching the Kings deers or something like that.

00:49:05.000 --> 00:49:06.000
I don't know a lot about this subject, I'll be honest with you, that's the only link I can think of.

00:49:06.000 --> 00:49:22.000
But I mean, there were prisons everywhere anyway. And remember that, the manorial courts were still working within it and they would have had to have dealt with people who were naughty as well.

00:49:22.000 --> 00:49:27.000
But it's a good question that well it's worth a google anyway so if you can find that more about it.

00:49:27.000 --> 00:49:28.000
Thank you for the question.

00:49:28.000 --> 00:49:39.000
Okay, okay. Have a had a couple of our members asking about the woods that the use of wood for naval ship building purposes.

00:49:39.000 --> 00:49:44.000
I don't know if you could tell us maybe just a little bit more about that. I know you touched on that towards the end there.

00:49:44.000 --> 00:49:45.000
Yeah, well, it was, as I say, from the end of the 17th century, and Samuel Peeks was a great promoter of that.

00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:56.000
This embarrassing incident when the touchbird, the Navy, during the Anglo-dutch Wars.

00:49:56.000 --> 00:50:00.000
I said, no, I'm laughing at that, but it seems quite funny, you know, rule Britannia and all that.

00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:10.000
But what they tended to do, was to grow. I think it sound like a ratio of 3 to one oak to beach.

00:50:10.000 --> 00:50:28.000
You know as in hearts of votes queue for a song there but also the beach was very important i think things like peels and decking a very very hard wood indeed So the whole thing was geared towards the production of battleships until the sort of 1st half of the 19th century.

00:50:28.000 --> 00:50:52.000
Buckler's Hard is one of the places on the Hamble estuary where you could still visit actually a historic rather expensive in private hands but you can still visit another historic Don't get I'm not chatting one that's a long way away, but you can you can you can visit one there and sort of try and imagine what it was like in the Napoleonic wartime for example when How you see there were lots of

00:50:52.000 --> 00:51:02.000
shipwrights and carpenters and heaven knows what working on the ships. We're right, timber, which was just probably dragged in largely from the new forest.

00:51:02.000 --> 00:51:12.000
That's, that's the limit of it. For the present anyway, otherwise you get into, you know, the history of naval architecture and I'm not an expert on that.

00:51:12.000 --> 00:51:13.000
Sure.

00:51:13.000 --> 00:51:22.000
Okay. Okay, another question from Guy. He's asking. Now I don't fully understand this question.

00:51:22.000 --> 00:51:30.000
I'm hoping you will. And were the perambulations, the same in nature as beating the bounds.

00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:32.000
I, I don't think so. I don't think choir boys were involved.

00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:42.000
I mean it was a legalistic, Got certain the choir boys weren't involved.

00:51:42.000 --> 00:51:51.000
It was a legalistic thing, but the officials would go and established under the legal statute, you know, the boundaries of the forest from time to time.

00:51:51.000 --> 00:52:03.000
I mean, again, I've glossed over a lot, but Henry the second we alluded to was very enthusiastic and he sort of pushed out into the woods and this wasn't always or popular.

00:52:03.000 --> 00:52:10.000
So you had Perleus, which is a Norman French name, which were areas which had been disoriented as Hale per year.

00:52:10.000 --> 00:52:19.000
Just down the road that way. We've had this kind of quasi status. They were no longer under full forest law, but I think things like the King had the pursuit of deer into them.

00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:33.000
So tell me to actually establish At any one time what the boundary of the forest was. Had serious legal implications and also land management implications for various interests.

00:52:33.000 --> 00:52:34.000
Good question that.

00:52:34.000 --> 00:52:44.000
Okay, there we go. Now, and I have another question here from Sue. And this is about no.

00:52:44.000 --> 00:52:49.000
She's asking is the new forest still being used for softwood production? Okay.

00:52:49.000 --> 00:52:56.000
Yeah, it says. Yeah. I mean, I, live in an interesting world, where I do understand the the needs to generate employment for people and things like the strategic interest.

00:52:56.000 --> 00:53:16.000
So beginning to guess what my politics probably are. Okay. And you have to balance that. Okay, the quite legitimate ones of Well, yeah, you know, of conservation and things like that.

00:53:16.000 --> 00:53:25.000
So the forestry commission solve was set up often to provide as come to throughout Europe to set up areas picked off the 1st war and so on.

00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:34.000
You know, for soldiers who come back who needed a job and that sort of thing. So, what can I say about that?

00:53:34.000 --> 00:53:40.000
It's all about the 70, s and 80, s this caliphous deforestation.

00:53:40.000 --> 00:53:45.000
And as you'd be a worth the owner, it was particularly fierce in your native Scotland.

00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:46.000
Hmm.

00:53:46.000 --> 00:53:55.000
Came under criticism. I mean the commercial side of it, not the Caledonian price, under criticism for wiping out a lot of the ecology that was there before.

00:53:55.000 --> 00:54:04.000
And certainly down here in the deep south you've got coniferous forests or woods which are entirely the result of escaped trees or scapegoes and things.

00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:12.000
From, forestry commission or private forestry activities as well. Now what the forestry commission tends to do now is to gradually replace at least on the outside of a lot of these blocks.

00:54:12.000 --> 00:54:22.000
It should have been connectorized, deciduous trees to bring them back. The Forest of Dean, which is the only other one, which is still under the forest origin.

00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:40.000
I understand that's quite a big idea that they've got their running in the forest of D to kind of have this mixed idea of conservation and also a commercial interests of forestry as well.

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:49.000
Very, very interesting. Right folks. I think we've got through most of your questions. I think we'll need to wrap up from there.

00:54:49.000 --> 00:54:54.000
Thanks very much for that, Hadrian. Really fascinating to hear all of that very, very complex history.

00:54:54.000 --> 00:55:14.000
And of the new forest I had certainly no idea that was quite so much behind it. And obviously a little bit about some of the current efforts to protect it as well and I hope everybody enjoyed that and found it interesting and maybe inspired to get on Google and find out a little bit more.

00:55:14.000 --> 00:55:19.000
And about the new forest and similar areas. So thanks again, Hadrian.

00:55:19.000 --> 00:55:28.000
Well, thank you all for being, well you had to be an attentive audience really, but thank you for being aive, I'm sure you were, and thank you for the questions and thank you Fiona.

00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:41.000
I know you have to do a lot of this. The sort of hostess with the MOST S but anyway I'll we'll talk and maybe I can do other topics later on if you think that's nice for our members.

00:55:41.000 --> 00:55:43.000
Thanks again.

00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:19.000
Okay. Well, thank you very much, And this afternoon. As you all know, that, it's a talk on the history of the watermill.

00:00:19.000 --> 00:00:30.000
Now the last time I spoke to you I spoke to you on the history of the windmill. And there were some obvious differences between the 2.

00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:42.000
The, the windmill of course derived its power from the wind. And the water meal derived its power from water.

00:00:42.000 --> 00:00:49.000
But there are a number of other. Principle differences that you should be aware of.

00:00:49.000 --> 00:00:59.000
The while windmills were used for grind in grain, to make flower or or for pumping.

00:00:59.000 --> 00:01:03.000
Water mills were much more versatile.

00:01:03.000 --> 00:01:17.000
And, the industries they were used for included Grinding grain. Company. Dry wood meals.

00:01:17.000 --> 00:01:27.000
Saul males need a males. It's enough. For the meals. And paint meals.

00:01:27.000 --> 00:01:35.000
And that's just a selection. Of the variety of industries.

00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:46.000
Now, surprisingly, because the water meal was more versatile than the windmills. They were far more water meals built.

00:01:46.000 --> 00:01:53.000
In this country. Then windmills.

00:01:53.000 --> 00:01:57.000
But today we're going to look at water mills.

00:01:57.000 --> 00:02:24.000
And I shall now start to share my screen.

00:02:24.000 --> 00:02:33.000
1st of all, some key dates. To put thee the history of the watermill into context.

00:02:33.000 --> 00:02:45.000
Now you will discover that there are different types of water mills. And we go back to, 85 BC at the top of this table.

00:02:45.000 --> 00:02:57.000
In which the Greeks Introduce the horizontal mill. Now these terms horizontal and also vertical.

00:02:57.000 --> 00:03:05.000
Describe the plane in which the water wheel rotates.

00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:09.000
Now for those who live in Scotland

00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:26.000
You have a particular interest in horizontal mills because They spread very much. Across Scotland. And I will show you a restored mill.

00:03:26.000 --> 00:03:30.000
In Orkney.

00:03:30.000 --> 00:03:43.000
But after the Greeks came the Romans, 20 B. We they invented the water wheel that we're most familiar with.

00:03:43.000 --> 00:03:50.000
And the 1st of the different types. Was called under shot.

00:03:50.000 --> 00:03:59.000
And now show you a photograph in a moment. To describe an undershot water wheel.

00:03:59.000 --> 00:04:10.000
Now the next date in the. Table. Was that it took a long time. Or road to be converted.

00:04:10.000 --> 00:04:19.000
To use in water mills. And the reason for that was that

00:04:19.000 --> 00:04:31.000
Previously, all the production of flower was done by the slaves. And the view was, well, If we introduce these water mills.

00:04:31.000 --> 00:04:40.000
What are we going to do with all these slaves? They could cause a lot of trouble. So that Rome.

00:04:40.000 --> 00:04:48.000
Took a long time. To recognize the benefits of water mills.

00:04:48.000 --> 00:04:59.000
Now because of that late date There's always been speculation as to whether the Romans brought The water mill to Britain.

00:04:59.000 --> 00:05:07.000
And I've got the date stare of the Roman occupation. And you'll see that, they left.

00:05:07.000 --> 00:05:15.000
Note too many years. After Rome converted to watermills.

00:05:15.000 --> 00:05:25.000
But in weeks and years, archaeologists have found Examples. Of Roman water meals. In Britain.

00:05:25.000 --> 00:05:34.000
So we do know that. The row is brought the idea. To us.

00:05:34.000 --> 00:05:48.000
Now the quite a pickle leak then. 1086. And the historians among you were know that Is it the date, the Tuesday book?

00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:59.000
It's a list of Properties, for tax purposes. And a value. Of the property.

00:05:59.000 --> 00:06:15.000
Well, water meals were. We're also a valuable resource. And throughout the Tuesday book there are over 6,000 Water mills recorded.

00:06:15.000 --> 00:06:25.000
When mills came later. So there are no wing mills. Recorded in the Domesday book.

00:06:25.000 --> 00:06:37.000
And then another date forward roughly in 1575. Mills were enlarged or rebuilt.

00:06:37.000 --> 00:06:45.000
And in many cases, if you go and visit a watermill, You will sometimes be told.

00:06:45.000 --> 00:06:54.000
That this is a Tuesday mill. Well, actually, that is most unlikely.

00:06:54.000 --> 00:07:05.000
Is likely to be a mill build on a Tuesday site. But all the dims they water mills were very small.

00:07:05.000 --> 00:07:16.000
Mays. They served the the farmer. That he brought the the grain. For.

00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:28.000
But by the end of the 15 hundreds. Mills were producing large quantities of grain.

00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:38.000
For bakers. And other industries. And to cope with this the mills were demolished.

00:07:38.000 --> 00:07:49.000
And, totally rebuild. But it additional storage.

00:07:49.000 --> 00:08:00.000
So we 1st of all look at thee the horizontal water wheels.

00:08:00.000 --> 00:08:12.000
And I've actually produced this drawing. To to help students understand it. It's a fairly simple Device.

00:08:12.000 --> 00:08:24.000
It's, derived from the, The Greek idea. And 1st of all the the water is diverted from a stream.

00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:34.000
In a shoot. Which hit these paddles. Which causes the paddle we ought to rotate.

00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:48.000
And that drive goes up. Until we have a pair of millstones. The lower millstones is the bedstone and it's fixed.

00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:52.000
That is the upper stone that rotates.

00:08:52.000 --> 00:09:05.000
Now, about this runners down, we have the hopper. In which the grain or in the case of Scotland often the oats.

00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:10.000
Were stored and fed into the millstones.

00:09:10.000 --> 00:09:23.000
Now in time the the mail, would begin to wear away. And so you had to maintain the distance between the 2 stones.

00:09:23.000 --> 00:09:32.000
And you'll notice that this is done by the fact that This drive here is on a hinged.

00:09:32.000 --> 00:09:39.000
Arrangement. We're a wedge. And so the.

00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:51.000
The farmer could adjust. The distance between the mills downs. By tapen this wedge.

00:09:51.000 --> 00:10:02.000
Now because these mills were quite a simple meal. There was no manner. As you associate with the much larger mill.

00:10:02.000 --> 00:10:13.000
And so the individual farmers who grew the grain or the oats. We don't come along.

00:10:13.000 --> 00:10:16.000
And make use of the mill.

00:10:16.000 --> 00:10:23.000
They would grind their grain or the ropes. And when they finish, they'll clean up.

00:10:23.000 --> 00:10:27.000
And take the the ground.

00:10:27.000 --> 00:10:31.000
Flower away with them.

00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:46.000
The actual mill itself was provided by the local landowner. As a service to the community.

00:10:46.000 --> 00:10:59.000
Now this is one such meal. Which is now preserved. So you can see is quite a small building built with local stone.

00:10:59.000 --> 00:11:03.000
And the roof was thatched.

00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:16.000
And this particular one, it was built in the early 18 hundreds. And finally cease work. In 1880.

00:11:16.000 --> 00:11:27.000
And is since being restored. Inside it's got all its, equipment.

00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:40.000
Now the reason why these mills were often called click mills is after the the sound. Of the machinery, the click click, click, click.

00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:54.000
And so that's the reason why this title. It's given to these mills in Scotland.

00:11:54.000 --> 00:12:07.000
And When I last visited. Edinburgh Museum several years ago. There was a display there of one of these paddles.

00:12:07.000 --> 00:12:19.000
And you can see the the blaze are angled. To allow the water coming down. It's in the wood.

00:12:19.000 --> 00:12:26.000
And calls them the paddle to rotate.

00:12:26.000 --> 00:12:34.000
Well, the more, Well, I'm doing. Water wheels are the vertical.

00:12:34.000 --> 00:12:45.000
Thrive from the Roman. In. And I'm going to show you 3 basic types.

00:12:45.000 --> 00:12:52.000
We've got the under shot. Down here on the lower right.

00:12:52.000 --> 00:13:06.000
Which is the Roman. Invention. Later came the breast shot in the middle here. And finally the overshot water wheel.

00:13:06.000 --> 00:13:11.000
In the top left hand corner.

00:13:11.000 --> 00:13:23.000
Now you may wonder why it is that we've got these 3 Basic types. And you explain that, I, I've drawn up.

00:13:23.000 --> 00:13:38.000
This line here which is This show you the, the section through the landscape. And we start with the overshot water wheel in the top.

00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:42.000
Leptine Corner.

00:13:42.000 --> 00:13:53.000
As we all know that when the the river start It's some normally an underground stream. Not a great deal.

00:13:53.000 --> 00:13:57.000
Of water.

00:13:57.000 --> 00:14:10.000
But it's sufficient water to deport. Into these buckets. And the the water drops.

00:14:10.000 --> 00:14:24.000
Down here to the diameter of the the wheel. And this makes it a very efficient design. 70%.

00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:30.000
When you come down Halfway down there will side.

00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:39.000
Then the. The slope of the hill begins due. Even help.

00:14:39.000 --> 00:14:49.000
But the volume of water increases because by now there are other rivers. Or streams feeding into it.

00:14:49.000 --> 00:15:01.000
So this water wheel The breast shod. Is ideal for high volume water. And to make the benefit of that.

00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:14.000
The the wheel is quite wide. The overshot is quite a narrow wheel. This is a wide wheel.

00:15:14.000 --> 00:15:24.000
But because, It's only 55% efficient. You need this extra volume of water.

00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:29.000
In order to generate your power.

00:15:29.000 --> 00:15:39.000
When you come down to the bottom Right hand corner, the anti-short. This is the least effective.

00:15:39.000 --> 00:15:43.000
Method of.

00:15:43.000 --> 00:15:52.000
Extracting energy from the water. But by now, of course, at the very bottom towards the valley.

00:15:52.000 --> 00:15:58.000
You have enormous volumes of water.

00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:08.000
And so, This compensates. Or the low efficiency.

00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:22.000
So what, You can tell from this, Joel. Is that even though the actual wheels are very different in design.

00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:31.000
They actually produce the same refuse same. Output. I were looking at.

00:16:31.000 --> 00:16:35.000
Bye, 12 4th power.

00:16:35.000 --> 00:16:41.000
So each of these wheels are produced in the same horsepower.

00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:53.000
But they're doing that. By changing the volume of water available. Which compensates for the difference.

00:16:53.000 --> 00:16:57.000
Efficiencies.

00:16:57.000 --> 00:17:08.000
Now to look actually look at what these. Wheels look like in practice. This is, one of the last.

00:17:08.000 --> 00:17:13.000
Water mills to be working in Cornwall.

00:17:13.000 --> 00:17:31.000
And, This is an undershot. So the water at the very bottom here. He's rather like a, it's like a We are on a puddle.

00:17:31.000 --> 00:17:44.000
And notice that this particular one that the the miner Can shut off the water completely. By this long pole.

00:17:44.000 --> 00:18:01.000
We then goes inside the mill. So he can raise or lower. It's loose. As required.

00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:16.000
Now this is a breast shot, water wheel. In which the v hits the wheel at mid height.

00:18:16.000 --> 00:18:22.000
This one's completely made of iron.

00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:33.000
No longer in use, but is being retained as a historical feature.

00:18:33.000 --> 00:18:43.000
And then this is the overshot water wheel. In which you can see the water pours. Into the buckets.

00:18:43.000 --> 00:18:49.000
At the top of the wheel.

00:18:49.000 --> 00:19:19.000
So this is the most efficient. Of the 3 types.

00:19:23.000 --> 00:19:33.000
Okay, that is possible. Onto the wheel. We have a weir. Across the river.

00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:37.000
And then there is a sluice.

00:19:37.000 --> 00:19:51.000
Which can be open and shut. Which diverts the water from the river. In what is called the head race.

00:19:51.000 --> 00:20:00.000
Now sometimes, of course, that the banner doesn't necessarily want to to use the the mail.

00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:08.000
And therefore there's an overflow. Back to the river.

00:20:08.000 --> 00:20:22.000
If he requires Do you use the water then you can shut this off? And the approach to the wheels called the penstock.

00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:31.000
So the water pours over the wheel. And operates the machinery inside the mail.

00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:49.000
And then the waters taken back to the river. In what has called the tail race.

00:20:49.000 --> 00:21:03.000
Now in contrast to the small meals in in opening. And we have the later water mills. Right in England and Wales.

00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:19.000
In which a much larger buildings were necessary.

00:21:19.000 --> 00:21:30.000
Another way of obtaining water to the mill. Is the make use of the tide.

00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:43.000
Now in this view, this is particular one in, Cornwall, you might say, I wonder why all these examples are in Cornwall, well that's where I grew up.

00:21:43.000 --> 00:21:51.000
And. But this is rather nice aerial picture. Of a tide mill.

00:21:51.000 --> 00:21:57.000
The mill is here, almost right in the middle of the photograph.

00:21:57.000 --> 00:22:08.000
And then you can see that, there is an enclosed pond. All the way along here.

00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:15.000
And there are some gates. Which are long since disappeared.

00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:26.000
Gates rather like those on your canal. Hinge gates. And as the The tide comes in.

00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:31.000
It forces its way through these gates.

00:22:31.000 --> 00:22:36.000
And fills up this pond.

00:22:36.000 --> 00:22:49.000
So when this photograph was taken. It's almost at full tide. Because the the water in the pond and in the river outside.

00:22:49.000 --> 00:22:52.000
Are the same.

00:22:52.000 --> 00:23:03.000
Well, as the tide starts to ebb These gates then close automatically.

00:23:03.000 --> 00:23:09.000
Trap in the water. In the pond.

00:23:09.000 --> 00:23:20.000
Now, because, Do you operate the mail you need a differences in water level. You have to wait a few hours.

00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:27.000
For the tide outside in the river to drop.

00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:39.000
By the water level in the pond remains constant. So, at a particular point The minute was then able to open the sluice here.

00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:50.000
And allow the water in the pond. To flow through the water wheel. And out into the river. And that would.

00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:57.000
Operate the machinery.

00:23:57.000 --> 00:24:07.000
Now we only had a few hours that he could do that before the time started to come in again.

00:24:07.000 --> 00:24:17.000
And because we know that the tide berries every day. In order to operate one the tight mills.

00:24:17.000 --> 00:24:22.000
It's involved working unsociable hours.

00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:37.000
Sometimes during the night. If you wanted to make maximum use. Of your time mail. So you can see they weren't particularly popular with the middle.

00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:48.000
Now the next photograph I'm actually stood down here with the arrow is Looking at the mill.

00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:51.000
And this is the mill.

00:24:51.000 --> 00:24:58.000
You can see the opening here to the water wheel.

00:24:58.000 --> 00:25:05.000
This is the. The wall enclosed in the pond.

00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:21.000
Outside that is the river. The gates, so mentioned a long since disappeared. And so now that the locals use the the to more up there.

00:25:21.000 --> 00:25:29.000
Oops. The meal itself is now being converted into a house.

00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:35.000
But you can see that it worked.

00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:42.000
Right up until 1916.

00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:55.000
And the amazing that, it didn't get demolished. Until recent years when the house conversion took place.

00:25:55.000 --> 00:26:05.000
Now, the industrial uses of water wheels. And we could take a long time in in looking at each individual one.

00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:17.000
So what I've done, I've got a selection. 2 to show you.

00:26:17.000 --> 00:26:28.000
Now the 1st one gaining Cornwall in a in what is now a museum. But, it was originally here.

00:26:28.000 --> 00:26:35.000
Before the Museum came along and Bristol it.

00:26:35.000 --> 00:26:43.000
But this particular water wheel and you can see it's an overshot water wheel you can see the water there.

00:26:43.000 --> 00:26:59.000
In the top medal or in out. On the penstock. Into the So this, is actually rotating.

00:26:59.000 --> 00:27:13.000
Now, the purpose of the water wheel was to to pump. Chine clay slurry. Out of the mine.

00:27:13.000 --> 00:27:26.000
Now, pump in. Any sort of liquid. We do water wheel. Is the most difficult thing to Organized.

00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:30.000
And the reason for that is that when the

00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:45.000
The water wheel is left in the slurry. It's enormous weight. Of fluid. And so the the water wheel is really straining.

00:27:45.000 --> 00:27:49.000
To live the fluid.

00:27:49.000 --> 00:28:01.000
Now once it's been lifted and discharged. Into a channel. The pump then goes back down.

00:28:01.000 --> 00:28:05.000
But is not then under load.

00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:10.000
So you've got a water wheel which,

00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:16.000
He's initially straining hard to lift the fluid.

00:28:16.000 --> 00:28:24.000
And then on the next stroke. It's got no load whatsoever.

00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:32.000
Now this is what we call an engineering terms. And the water wheel would rates.

00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:51.000
It would, slowly move around while the flow was being raised. But it would rush around. When the the pumps were going down under no low whatsoever.

00:28:51.000 --> 00:29:03.000
And to overcome that. It's a very ingenious method. Called a balance box.

00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:10.000
And this. Wooden structure here. In the top left hand corner.

00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:14.000
It's the balance box.

00:29:14.000 --> 00:29:24.000
And it's supported by a triangular timber. Which disappears inside the stonework.

00:29:24.000 --> 00:29:33.000
And it's connected at the bottom. By this iron rod.

00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:40.000
You see the road disappear in there into the. Undergrowth.

00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:54.000
Now that, is filled with heavy stone. Or lead any weights that They can get their hands on.

00:29:54.000 --> 00:29:58.000
Is put into the balance box.

00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:09.000
And the cycle of operation. Is that. When the water will

00:30:09.000 --> 00:30:18.000
Is at a point when The the pumps are going down. And therefore not under load.

00:30:18.000 --> 00:30:24.000
It's raised in. The balance box.

00:30:24.000 --> 00:30:28.000
So the water wheel

00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:38.000
Is under stream because he's doing work. In in raising the balance box.

00:30:38.000 --> 00:30:50.000
When the pump is at the bottom and the china clay slurries. There's more of it to to be raised.

00:30:50.000 --> 00:30:57.000
This balance box. Is then on the downward cycle.

00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:07.000
So where is the the water wheel is under strain in lifting the fluid? It is also helped.

00:31:07.000 --> 00:31:15.000
By the fact that there's so enormous weight. He's beginning to drop.

00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:29.000
So what this means is the water wheel is under Strain. At all times. Whether it's lifting fluid.

00:31:29.000 --> 00:31:32.000
All going down empty.

00:31:32.000 --> 00:31:44.000
So this is quite an ingenious. Technical solution. To a problem which, Our ancestors struggled.

00:31:44.000 --> 00:31:58.000
To overcome.

00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:08.000
Now in North Devon I'm now owned by the National Trust. Is the Finch Foundry.

00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:16.000
And we've all seen, and blacksmiths. I'm hammering. Bits and metal.

00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:32.000
Well, this was. Done on industrial scale. Because this particular male provided agricultural tools to in local farmers.

00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:44.000
Soives and and so on. And to shape these particular, bits, a metal, they would be heated up.

00:32:44.000 --> 00:32:57.000
And instead of the The blacksmith have been too physically himself. Hammering the metal. He had the assistance of these.

00:32:57.000 --> 00:33:13.000
Hey weights. And there was a series of cans. Which left these up. And then, allow them to drop down.

00:33:13.000 --> 00:33:21.000
Now all of these cams were operated by water wheels.

00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:29.000
So you can imagine the the blacksmith standing with one here and one here. With his.

00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:53.000
Red Hot Metal. And shape in the sides. Under these. Hammers.

00:33:53.000 --> 00:34:05.000
Now we've seen. Millstones. One above the other. I've talked about that stone in the runner stone.

00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:13.000
But there were some processes which, the stones were put on their edge.

00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:24.000
And, this particular one is, a gum powder mill. In, in Kent.

00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:33.000
And that you can well imagine that it was quite a dangerous operation. And the.

00:34:33.000 --> 00:34:44.000
The gunpowder was made of 75 parts of potassium nitrite. 7 parts, sulphur.

00:34:44.000 --> 00:34:49.000
And 15 pars of charcoal.

00:34:49.000 --> 00:34:52.000
And this was all them.

00:34:52.000 --> 00:34:57.000
Put into this saucer-shape arrangement.

00:34:57.000 --> 00:35:06.000
And as the mills, rotated. And also turned around in this direction.

00:35:06.000 --> 00:35:15.000
It. Produce the these mixtures to a powder. Which.

00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:22.000
When it was complete. Was gunpowder.

00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:33.000
Not surprisingly, there were accidents and explosions and and people lost their lives and they were injuries and so on.

00:35:33.000 --> 00:35:42.000
So not a particularly attractive. Process. No, these edge runners.

00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:51.000
We're actually used in other industries. Indeed, them one near me in place called Tansham.

00:35:51.000 --> 00:36:05.000
Near Bristol. I was huge for what is called a dye wood. Yeah. And it was used to produce them.

00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:12.000
Powders too. Die, cloth.

00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:24.000
What they did, they in ported. And logwood. And Brazil would These were invariably all.

00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:35.000
From overseas. So these dye wood meals were often convenient to. The ports.

00:36:35.000 --> 00:36:49.000
In the case of the wanting King June that the wood came in from overseas to to Bristol. And then there was the Kenned and Avon Canal.

00:36:49.000 --> 00:36:57.000
Where the barges could bring thee the wood. 2, change him.

00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:07.000
Well, before they could, put this wood. Under an edge runner. It had to be chipped away.

00:37:07.000 --> 00:37:14.000
And they were. And machines called a chipper.

00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:21.000
In which they would chip away slithers of timber.

00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:31.000
And it's these letters of timber which would have been placed. In the soul, sir. To be pounded.

00:37:31.000 --> 00:37:37.000
Into a powder.

00:37:37.000 --> 00:37:49.000
And then. But, would. And gave pink. And red dyes.

00:37:49.000 --> 00:38:02.000
The logwood which came from the Westing days in Central America. And gave. With other assorted chemicals red.

00:38:02.000 --> 00:38:07.000
Violet or navy blue.

00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:18.000
So, our ancestors when they, they wore colorful cloven. You wouldn't believe the amount of work.

00:38:18.000 --> 00:38:44.000
That was involved. In D in the clock. And preparing the materials. And it was a water mill that, Provided the energy to do that.

00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:53.000
Maybe the other process, the. And it's also as you see comes from Cornwall.

00:38:53.000 --> 00:39:04.000
Am called the told us Tim Mill? Now, in Cornwall, of course, that, for many years.

00:39:04.000 --> 00:39:17.000
Tin was extracted from, The stonework. And it was a very profitable industry. So much so that,

00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:27.000
A lot of the smaller quantities of tin were literally shown to one side in in a huge pile.

00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:38.000
Because it just wasn't worth the processing. Well, eventually, of course, the the tin began to run out.

00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:52.000
And so suddenly these piles of tin rich or became valuable. And to extract. The 10. They had these.

00:39:52.000 --> 00:39:56.000
Rower Stamps

00:39:56.000 --> 00:40:11.000
In which the waste material was placed underneath. And we have a water wheel which rotates this huge metal drum.

00:40:11.000 --> 00:40:22.000
And you will see that what's called cams here. And these are left. These vertical metal.

00:40:22.000 --> 00:40:47.000
Rolls and then they lay them the drop. So there will be constant pounding. Of the tin rich or in order to extract the tin.

00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:57.000
And from Cornwall, travel all the way up to Scotland. Is it a meal which I visited many years ago?

00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:05.000
It's now restored by, the National Trust of Scotland.

00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:09.000
And you can see the external water wheel.

00:41:09.000 --> 00:41:24.000
While most, water mills do have. The external water wheel some actually position the water wheel inside the building.

00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:28.000
To give it some protection.

00:41:28.000 --> 00:41:39.000
Nice particular meal was used for grinding of oats. Something which is very much associated with Scotland.

00:41:39.000 --> 00:41:46.000
And this particular little building here with the the dome cap.

00:41:46.000 --> 00:41:53.000
Well, inside there, there will be fires lit.

00:41:53.000 --> 00:42:03.000
And the idea was that, to dry the oats. Before they were round.

00:42:03.000 --> 00:42:15.000
If we had, as we, have had in this country. We recently, weeks and weeks of wet weather.

00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:24.000
Then, the grain or the oats. Could be extremely wet when there were harvested.

00:42:24.000 --> 00:42:34.000
And you cannot grind. East materials when there are soak in red. And so that.

00:42:34.000 --> 00:42:47.000
This is on the East Coast of Scotland. You're. And it was necessary to dry the oats before they could be crammed.

00:42:47.000 --> 00:43:00.000
So this is a particularly local feature for Scotland.

00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:11.000
And this is my Last slide, so I will be. And it back to Fiona now.

00:43:11.000 --> 00:43:24.000
Thank you very much, Michael. We'll go straight, to some questions. And now, I have a couple of questions for you which to start off with which is kind of comparing the watermills and the windmills.

00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:36.000
So 1st of all, from 10 What's actually more efficient in terms of horsepower, a windmill or a watermill?

00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:54.000
Well, I would say a water mill. It was far more efficient. PA windmill is limited in the amount of energy it can extract from the wind.

00:43:54.000 --> 00:44:08.000
Where is the water over a shot, water wheel. It's extremely powerful. Indeed.

00:44:08.000 --> 00:44:21.000
Water wheels went on in the industrial evolution. To power in manufacturers. Of all the machinery.

00:44:21.000 --> 00:44:31.000
Until such times as the steam engine overtook them. But the water we always certainly the more efficient.

00:44:31.000 --> 00:44:34.000
Power generated.

00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:42.000
Hey, right there we go. Now another question sort of comparing the 2. And is from David.

00:44:42.000 --> 00:44:46.000
He's saying he believes that it was necessary to have a license for a windmill to operate a windmill.

00:44:46.000 --> 00:44:55.000
In England Did that also apply to watermills?

00:44:55.000 --> 00:45:02.000
No, I don't think so that I haven't come across this. Farms are licenses.

00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:18.000
This is very much a I think I'm a more modern thing with the department and the environment. And and looking at their water resources and and so on.

00:45:18.000 --> 00:45:32.000
And as we know that, So much of our rivers are depleted in the volume of water because, So much is being diverted.

00:45:32.000 --> 00:45:46.000
In to providing them. And water for the domestic population. Drinking water and and and so on showers and whatever

00:45:46.000 --> 00:45:58.000
So that they're very few, of course, working, water, water mills today. That some of them got historical rights.

00:45:58.000 --> 00:46:06.000
But some of them are struggling with them. Depleted water levels.

00:46:06.000 --> 00:46:18.000
Yep. Okay. Alright, moving on. I've got a question from Stuart.

00:46:18.000 --> 00:46:19.000
Yes.

00:46:19.000 --> 00:46:26.000
But when you were talking about the horizontal, er, watermills, Stuart saying presumably the horizontal mill was because the Greeks didn't understand gearing.

00:46:26.000 --> 00:46:33.000
Because the under shot through the breast shot is so much more obvious. I don't know what your thoughts are on that, Michael.

00:46:33.000 --> 00:46:37.000
Well, the

00:46:37.000 --> 00:46:44.000
Well, it, it might be, a bit more obvious that, They're having them too short.

00:46:44.000 --> 00:46:48.000
It didn't, didn't actually occur to the Greeks.

00:46:48.000 --> 00:47:02.000
And And so the horizontal water mill was invented by the Greeks and is indeed It's still in use.

00:47:02.000 --> 00:47:05.000
In places throughout the world.

00:47:05.000 --> 00:47:16.000
I was given a talk. Little time we go on water mills. And one of my students, they've been to Malaysia.

00:47:16.000 --> 00:47:27.000
And he brought along to the class some slides. Showing a working horizontal watermelon.

00:47:27.000 --> 00:47:38.000
And it was. In its simplicity, it meant that. You didn't actually require a lot of money.

00:47:38.000 --> 00:47:42.000
To build a horizontal mill.

00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:50.000
But this particular individual was making a good living from it.

00:47:50.000 --> 00:48:00.000
Where is As I mentioned, water mills in this country, particularly in England.

00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:10.000
Grew in size. And so they became very expensive. To build. And to maintain.

00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:19.000
So the the horizontal water mill had its advantages.

00:48:19.000 --> 00:48:37.000
Okay. Right. What do we have next for you? Yes, you have talked sort of fairly early on in the presentation about local landowners.

00:48:37.000 --> 00:48:38.000
Yes.

00:48:38.000 --> 00:48:53.000
You know, having these mills as a kind of service to the local community. Jill's asking, Would, would it have been more that landlords insisted that the farmers use their mills so that they got the payments and the taxes and all of these kinds of things.

00:48:53.000 --> 00:49:02.000
Well, there was an element of that, yes. And and and certainly in England.

00:49:02.000 --> 00:49:19.000
When we had. A particular . In which, the, the farmers or the individuals in their houses in a domestic situation.

00:49:19.000 --> 00:49:36.000
Where indeed required. To take their green to the local mill. And and to get the miller there to to minute to produce their flower.

00:49:36.000 --> 00:49:50.000
I don't know that, It was quite as straight. Is that in Scotland? But in England, yes, it was almost a compulsion.

00:49:50.000 --> 00:50:09.000
And indeed, There are examples. The Lord the Manors sending his is staff to domestic properties. And finding a small and Millstone's being used.

00:50:09.000 --> 00:50:24.000
And they will become being taken away and broken up. In order to force people. To use thee the Lord of the manners mills.

00:50:24.000 --> 00:50:29.000
But I think it was bit more relaxed in Scotland.

00:50:29.000 --> 00:50:39.000
Okay, interesting. No. This is a question from Jill. This is when you were talking about the tide mills.

00:50:39.000 --> 00:50:40.000
Yes. See.

00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:49.000
I didn't know even existed. And she's asking if these whatever also used for irrigation.

00:50:49.000 --> 00:50:55.000
Not that I'm aware of, no.

00:50:55.000 --> 00:51:04.000
Okay. Now what else do we have? Right, we've got a number of questions which I'm gonna sort of roll kind of sort of into one.

00:51:04.000 --> 00:51:13.000
Around the use of water mills today. So I've got questions from Tim, one from Kathleen and one from Jane.

00:51:13.000 --> 00:51:33.000
Now, So firstly, Tim was asking, are there any commercial water mills in use today? And from Kathleen, could we make more use of watermills for generating power, which is what what Jane was asking as well, the thing that springs to mind to me in certain we've got plenty of them in Scotland as hydroelectric power.

00:51:33.000 --> 00:51:48.000
Yeah. Well, the There are a few working water mills. And not too many, there has been said.

00:51:48.000 --> 00:52:02.000
But when we had locked down. Now you will remember that when you went into the supermarkets that there was no flower on the shelves.

00:52:02.000 --> 00:52:13.000
And this was caused by the fact that there were so many of us stuck at home. And particularly those with children.

00:52:13.000 --> 00:52:23.000
And and suddenly they discover the the wonders of baking. And and and so they all rushed to the supermarket.

00:52:23.000 --> 00:52:38.000
To Dubai their, their flower, bread flour. And and And, and so for the majority of the population, suddenly we were faced with a shortage.

00:52:38.000 --> 00:52:49.000
No, interesting enough that it wasn't actually a shortage of flower. It was a shortage of bags.

00:52:49.000 --> 00:52:53.000
Because they.

00:52:53.000 --> 00:53:05.000
The massive meals. That we have today. Hoover's mills and so on. I'm produced in vast quantities of flour.

00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:16.000
For making braid. And they supply their flour to in industrial bakers. In huge sacks.

00:53:16.000 --> 00:53:31.000
And they meant that they actually produced for supermarkets. For the general population it is quite small. And so they didn't have sufficient bags.

00:53:31.000 --> 00:53:44.000
To Produce the smaller quantities. Now just an example in my time where I live. One of the local shops.

00:53:44.000 --> 00:53:59.000
Frustrated by the The lack of flour that thickers sell. To the customers. And so in the end they bought One of these huge sacks.

00:53:59.000 --> 00:54:11.000
No, And and and then they produce their own small bags.

00:54:11.000 --> 00:54:24.000
And then. Dispensed all this flour in their big sacks. Into the small ones. In order to sell.

00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:36.000
So it was particular. The difficult period. And many water males. On one side large numbers but say 20.

00:54:36.000 --> 00:54:46.000
In this country. Which up to them produce their flower. Almost like a sideline for visitors to their mill.

00:54:46.000 --> 00:55:01.000
Suddenly started to produce flower day and night. So, fortunately, we, we do have. Some work in watermills.

00:55:01.000 --> 00:55:07.000
Producing particularly flour. Or make him braid.

00:55:07.000 --> 00:55:17.000
Nowadays, We know things are settled down there. They've gone back to producing smaller quantities.

00:55:17.000 --> 00:55:22.000
For visitors.

00:55:22.000 --> 00:55:32.000
Okay, interesting and what about the idea of making use of watermills for generating power.

00:55:32.000 --> 00:55:33.000
Hmm.

00:55:33.000 --> 00:55:39.000
Oh, very much so. I would think that, of the schemes that I've heard about.

00:55:39.000 --> 00:55:46.000
That anyone who's fortunate enough to actually own a watermill for a number of them.

00:55:46.000 --> 00:55:57.000
I've been converted. Into generating electricity. And that's done by a different system they don't have a water wheel.

00:55:57.000 --> 00:56:18.000
They have a turbine. Which is is below the the mill. Actually in the water. In the river and and It's the flow of the water that provides the rotation.

00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:19.000
Hmm.

00:56:19.000 --> 00:56:32.000
That generates electricity. So yes, there are many green schemes. But not huge. You know, there's not enough electricity generated to provide.

00:56:32.000 --> 00:56:33.000
Okay.

00:56:33.000 --> 00:56:38.000
Electricity for a whole town. Certainly. A small number of houses.

00:56:38.000 --> 00:56:39.000
Yes, nice.

00:56:39.000 --> 00:56:44.000
Yeah, I guess that's the principle behind some of the large kind of hydroelectric power stations that we have.

00:56:44.000 --> 00:56:51.000
Well, that's right. That's right. Yes, when you got, a dam.

00:56:51.000 --> 00:57:05.000
And it is those type of sizeable constructions that that produce their electricity on a on a grand scale.

00:57:05.000 --> 00:57:07.000
We've got the benefit of some very high mountains as well that

00:57:07.000 --> 00:57:11.000
Well, that's right, yes, Scotland's got plenty of rain in there.

00:57:11.000 --> 00:57:21.000
Okay, no. We've got a few more questions. I'm going to sort of run on the QA Q&A just for another few minutes.

00:57:21.000 --> 00:57:30.000
Question from Jane she heard that there are water myth watermills on Hadrian's wall is that right?

00:57:30.000 --> 00:57:31.000
Yeah.

00:57:31.000 --> 00:57:37.000
I think as true. Yes, yes, and that would have obviously been a Roman water mill. That would be one of the.

00:57:37.000 --> 00:57:39.000
Yeah.

00:57:39.000 --> 00:57:44.000
The ones that the old colleges have discovered. Yes.

00:57:44.000 --> 00:57:56.000
Okay. Right, and I, let's have a look here. No, you were talking about some watermills still being used in other parts of the world.

00:57:56.000 --> 00:58:09.000
This is from Margaret. She believes that in Nepal and India watermills are still widely used for producing grain, but they have replaced some of the wooden parts with metal.

00:58:09.000 --> 00:58:20.000
Yeah, yeah, yes, I think in. And almost certainly they will be. Horizontal mills.

00:58:20.000 --> 00:58:21.000
Hmm.

00:58:21.000 --> 00:58:32.000
Because in a poor economy. As I mentioned, the horizontal meal is not too expensive to pay wood.

00:58:32.000 --> 00:58:39.000
You've seen the one in Orkney. You know, local stones, the thatched roof.

00:58:39.000 --> 00:58:50.000
Timber inside. You know, it doesn't take too much effort to, and cost to actually produce.

00:58:50.000 --> 00:58:58.000
Okay. And right, we've got a couple more questions and then I think we'll need to wrap up folks.

00:58:58.000 --> 00:58:59.000
Hmm.

00:58:59.000 --> 00:59:11.000
A question from Erika. In the industrial revolution. Was one of the 3 types of watermills mentioned more prevalent than the other 2.

00:59:11.000 --> 00:59:18.000
Oh, certainly overshot water wheels. Would have been used during the Industrial Revolution.

00:59:18.000 --> 00:59:19.000
Cause that's the most

00:59:19.000 --> 00:59:29.000
Yes, that's right, the most efficient. Because of course they drove. A lot of machinery.

00:59:29.000 --> 00:59:37.000
You know, you've seen no doubt, pictures of restored. Weaving machines and so on.

00:59:37.000 --> 00:59:45.000
Produce in cloth Well, there was large, there were a large number of these broken together.

00:59:45.000 --> 00:59:55.000
And and they required huge amount of power. And the only way to achieve that was an overshot water wheel.

00:59:55.000 --> 01:00:00.000
And they they built their own reservoirs.

01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:13.000
Indeed. If you've seen that, program that,

01:00:13.000 --> 01:00:14.000
Oh yeah.

01:00:14.000 --> 01:00:19.000
About the selling competition. On television at the moment. And, and, and, and that's actually held in, in a meal.

01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:29.000
And you will see from the the shots of that the reservoir and meet in the outside. Which provided the the power.

01:00:29.000 --> 01:00:38.000
To the water mill. So that. That was quite common in the industrial evolution.

01:00:38.000 --> 01:00:46.000
Hmm. Interesting. I didn't know that because I do actually watch that. So, I'll take a closer look when I watch it next time.

01:00:46.000 --> 01:00:47.000
Yeah.

01:00:47.000 --> 01:01:04.000
Right, final question from Jan. This is maybe going slightly off slightly, but, she's saying, would you be able to say anything about the cutlery and steel industry kind of around the Sheffield area which she believes was driven by water power.

01:01:04.000 --> 01:01:11.000
Yeah, I'm asking. I don't know a great deal about the. The Sheffield.

01:01:11.000 --> 01:01:24.000
Steel industry. But certainly there would have been similar to The blacksmith shop that I showed you.

01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:25.000
Hmm.

01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:38.000
But much more delicate. Difference between now producing size for farmers and the more delicate work of producing.

01:01:38.000 --> 01:01:39.000
Hmm.

01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:42.000
Knives and forks and so on. But the principle would have been the same.

01:01:42.000 --> 01:01:50.000
Okay, well there we go, John. Right. And I think we need to wrap up there. And Michael, that was really interesting stuff.

01:01:50.000 --> 01:02:03.000
And certainly I, I don't know about anyone else. I certainly tended to think of windmills and watermills as being pretty much the same.

01:02:03.000 --> 01:02:04.000
Hmm.

01:02:04.000 --> 01:02:17.000
So it's really interesting to hear how the watermills were so so much more versatile and had so many uses than the windmills and it was really nice to see Preston Corn Mill which funnily enough I walked past last year when I was walking part of the John Muir way and didn't really know what it was.

01:02:17.000 --> 01:02:18.000
Okay.

01:02:18.000 --> 01:02:30.000
And now I know. So it was really, really good to see that. So hope everybody enjoyed that and I hope it's whetted your appetite to find out a little bit more than get on Google and read a bit more about it.

01:02:30.000 --> 01:02:33.000
So thanks very much again, Michael.

01:02:33.000 --> 01:02:35.000
Okay, thank you. Nice to see you all.

01:02:35.000 --> 01:02:41.000
Thank you

00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:09.000
Great, thank you Fiona and good afternoon everyone. Good to be with you again from Embers Lecture.

00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:13.000
And I should go straight into sharing my screen.

00:00:13.000 --> 00:00:18.000
And playing my slideshow.

00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:26.000
So I'm going to be asking the the seems like a straightforward question, actually quite a complicated question of how the Reformation changed art.

00:00:26.000 --> 00:00:33.000
Well just for a beginning for a taster, here's what art looked like before the Reformation.

00:00:33.000 --> 00:00:40.000
This is Van Ike's Ghent altarpiece. Done in around 1430. And it tells the story of creation and the fall of human beings.

00:00:40.000 --> 00:01:03.000
Here's poor old Adam looking shameful. Covered himself with a fig leaf, there's Eve on the other side, God in the center, saints either side of them with angels and the bottom panels are about the end of the world in the book of Revelation and all of creation gathering together around the cross.

00:01:03.000 --> 00:01:15.000
Oh, does this? This is Botticelli's Annunciation. The enunciation was one of the favourite themes of the Renaissance because it was about a new birth and a fresh beginning.

00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:18.000
But just look at this, fast forward 50 years or so. And went to Bruegel. And this is Bruegel peasants dancing.

00:01:18.000 --> 00:01:32.000
All these people celebrating different sorts of dances, not a religious symbol in sight. Or a little bit later and here Rembrandt.

00:01:32.000 --> 00:01:41.000
And Rembrandt was a specialist, not just in portraits, but also in portraits of, the grandees of Amsterdam at the time.

00:01:41.000 --> 00:01:49.000
And he was commissioned by many of them. So we've shifted really quite quickly from art like that.

00:01:49.000 --> 00:02:01.000
With a very religious theme. I'm showing some of the central tenets of the Christian faith. To art which really has no religious input obviously at all into it.

00:02:01.000 --> 00:02:08.000
How do we get there? Well, I'm going to give you a very rough rundown of the beginnings of the Reformation.

00:02:08.000 --> 00:02:18.000
And what it meant and then look in some detail. And how it affected art. So, the background, the Reformation, we all think we know about the Reformation.

00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:26.000
We all think it's about Henry VIII and his 6 wives, but actually they're the sideshow in the Continental Reformation.

00:02:26.000 --> 00:02:28.000
There's a lot of oversimplification to background. Late medieval Europe was complex and diverse.

00:02:28.000 --> 00:02:39.000
The Pope, the Pope's involvement in political intrigues had been running back for centuries and the been increasing tensions between the papacy and secular politics.

00:02:39.000 --> 00:02:45.000
The monument of martyrdom of Thomas Beckett in 1170 is a really good example of that.

00:02:45.000 --> 00:03:07.000
That tension was more than anything else about the tension between the King and the Pope. Then there was the increasing pardon wealth of the church in the late Middle Ages and that was certainly building up a lot of resentments.

00:03:07.000 --> 00:03:17.000
One of the things the church was doing to collect money was the sale of indulgences. The idea that you could buy your way into heaven.

00:03:17.000 --> 00:03:24.000
By contributing to the church or you could buy your grandmother's way into heaven by contributing to the church.

00:03:24.000 --> 00:03:34.000
But having said all of that and there are lots of excesses and and and bad uses, having said all that the majority of people are still loyal to Catholic Church.

00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:43.000
They still gain spiritual comfort and guidance from it and there's a big danger of exaggerating the excesses.

00:03:43.000 --> 00:03:48.000
Also in the background all this is the Black Death. There was huge turmoil in the 14th century because of the Black Death and the social economic of changes that brought about.

00:03:48.000 --> 00:04:01.000
And then printing was in historians often say that without printing, there would have been no reformation.

00:04:01.000 --> 00:04:18.000
Because what printing did was to allow the dissemination of information very quickly. Rather than hear one person talk you could print 500 or a thousand little booklets or leaflets and send them around Europe particularly to the universities.

00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:27.000
And the development of the universities in major European cities was one of the driving forces behind the Reformation.

00:04:27.000 --> 00:04:36.000
But the Reformation doesn't start with Luther, as most people think it does. It goes way back before then.

00:04:36.000 --> 00:04:44.000
And there were stirrings of reformation for 3 or maybe 4 centuries. One of those stirrings in this country was John Wycliffe.

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There is dates. Wickcliffe blamed the clergy for the black death which was a bit unfair.

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But he did say and this is a precursor to the Reformation that Scripture is the only reliable guide.

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To truth. You can't trust the Pope. You can't trust the clergy.

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You can't trust anyone except scripture. And on the basis of that John Wycliffe rejected Purgatory.

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A purgatory was the idea that when you die, you don't go straight to heaven or hell.

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What you do is lurk around somewhere. Or maybe thousands of years, while you're punished for your sins.

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And at the end of that punishment you become clean and pure so you can go up to heaven. Wecliff rejected this idea.

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Not a biblical idea, he said. It was just a way really of getting money out of the masses.

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Because you could buy time out of purgatory. And also Wycliffe illegally. Took part in the translation of the Bible into English.

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Until then the Bible's only in Latin. Therefore most people didn't understand it. And the authorities at the time, including the king, took the view that allowing ordinary people to read the Bible was dangerous.

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They might make up their own mind about things. And then on the continent, there's Jan Hus in Prague.

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Jan Hus was also a reformer. He was critical of indulgences as well, and he proposed the reform of the papacy.

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And was burned at the stake in July, 1415. You can see this, this is a sort of head of steam building up all across the continent which is criticizing Catholicism.

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Which is, arguing for reform.

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And this is when it really took off. This is Martin Luther. An Augustinian monk there are his dates And in October 1517 He went to the door of his local church, Bittenburg, and he nailed to the door.

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What are known as 95 theses. Now this wasn't a strange thing to do. It was quite normal in university towns.

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If you wanted to have a debate about something or start a book club or a discussion about something, you took a notice and you stuck it to the church door or the door of the college.

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And Luther nailed these 95 theses allegedly we're not absolutely sure this was a historical election to the door.

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And they were critical. They were suggestions for debate, however. They weren't meant to be revolutionary.

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But some of the questions he asked do look in historical terms like revolutionary points. Why does not the Pope, for example, he said, whose wealth today is greater than the wealth of the richest crasses, build the Basilicrous and Peter with his own money.

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Rather than with the money of poor believers. So one of his objections was the way in which the church was taking money from poor people.

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And Luther's main issues were these. First, st the sale of indulgences. The idea that you buy your way to heaven.

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Secondly, and now we're getting more theological, secondly, he argued that the way you are saved The way you go to heaven is not by good works by doing good things, but rather by God's free gift by grace.

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And that really is right at the centre of Protestant theology. He objected obviously the wealth of the Catholic Church.

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But the 4th point Is that something's often forgotten. That the Reformation is just as much about political independence from Rome in its early years as it is about theology.

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And Luther in his German state and the German states were flexing their muscles against Rome. England was certainly flexing its muscles against Rome and for all his trouble Luther is excommunicated in 1520.

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So now to the art, what does the odd look like? Well, Luke is Cranach.

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Was a friend of of Martin Luther living in Wittenberg at the same time and he began to interpret Luther's theology in art.

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Pre-reformation, 15 0 3, this is what Cranach is doing. He's doing fairly traditional religious paintings.

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Here's a crucifixion painting. With 2 women at the foot of the cross or Mary and John at the foot of the cross.

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Slightly strange layout in that we see Jesus and the 2 thieves crucified with him, not on a single plane as they usually are, but at right angles to each other.

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But nevertheless a fairly traditional piece. As is this a fairly traditional mother and child. Looking at each other, set in a in a background which is unusual for these and here's the child with a bunch of grapes.

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Symbolising the symbolising the mass, the Euchre, the communion service. So far so good and so far so traditional.

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But here, Cranach is attempting to interpret Luther's theology. And we moved on quite a lot.

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Let me look at these 2 panels separately.

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The left hand panel, it tells the story of the human fall. He is the mythology of ana and Eve taken from the book of Genesis.

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I don't and Eve with the snake there curling around the tree with forbidden fruit on it from which Adam and Eve are about to eat and therefore disobey God.

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The effect of that is the poor old Adam here he is, is chased by demons who are prodding him.

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He's racked with guilt. He can't help but sin. And even though he studies the law, this is the law on the tablets of stone, and is advised by all these wise men.

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It doesn't do him any good. He still has this uncertainty in guilt. All he can do, says Luther's theology interpreted by interpreted by Cranach, is to look at the cross.

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Here is John the Baptist, pointing poor old Adam. Every man, every woman, you and I, towards the cross and towards the resurrection.

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And here's Jesus risen from the dead having slain the demon having slain the the the dragon the snake that was the original tempter.

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Now, not only does Cranach paint that. But he realizes, as do many artists at the time, you can go into print.

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I mean you go into print. Instead of one image. There's the one. You can do hundreds of images.

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So this image, precisely the same as what we've just seen. This image of Luther's theology is being sent all around Germany.

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And then all around the rest of Europe. And was transmitting Luther's theology almost instantaneously across Europe.

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In effect, it was the Internet of the Day. Information could travel very, very quickly compared with what it used to be, which was a monk or a scribe slowly writing a manuscript.

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The other thing chronic did a lot of was illustration of Luther's new Bible. Luther translated the Bible into German.

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And we see here one of the illustrations from the book of Revelation, the final book of the New Testament.

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The Reformation speeded up with John Calvin. Luther really was was aiming for a fairly gentle reformation.

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Calvin was much tougher. Calvin Firstly was anti-art. He was anti-art and anti-music because they distract you if they're there in church, they distract you from the Word of God.

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Calvin said that the metaphors for human existence were an abyss. In which human beings have lost their way.

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A labyrinth from which we cannot escape. As you can see is not an awfully cheerful sort of chap.

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And the effect of all of this was that he insisted on stripping churches. There was no visual art.

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There's no music other than the singing of Psalms, though no stained glass windows clergy were not to wear colorful vestments.

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Because all of those things would distract you. They would detract from the Word of God which you were meant to listen to and respond to.

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That by Calvin had a huge impact throughout Europe.

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Let's see how it was affected in this country. I've put up the interesting historical question, was Henry a Protestant?

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And and and and historians will argue lots and lots about that and in many ways he wasn't.

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In many ways he retained his Catholic faith. But on the other hand he rejected papal authority.

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The 2 are not the same. And eventually, particularly under Elizabeth the First, st England opted for a middle way.

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A church which was part Catholic and part Protestant. But that's that's another lecture.

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We're not going into that now. But the English background the Reformation is something like this. The tensions with Rome had been going on for centuries.

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All way back to Beckett and his martyrdom, 1170. Part of the background was the Wars of Roses.

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Henry needed to secure a succession. He had to have a male heir. And he'd go to any links to get a mail heir.

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On the continent the Reformation was gathering pace. Remember, 1517 Luther. By the time we pop across to England, we're talking about the 15 thirtys, so it's already been happening for 1015 years on the continent.

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And was spreading here through the universities. People in Oxford were convinced that the Reformation was necessary, perhaps by about 1522.

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And reformers seeking refuge particularly from Germany in Holland were coming across the channel. I'm seeking refuge here.

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The other thing of course is that Henry was broke. He got no money. No money partly because of the Wars of the Roses had continued for so long and also because England and France kept having wars with each other and Henry was involved in the huge expansion of royal palaces.

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And that's how we think Henry looks. And we think Henry looks like that because of because of this guy, because of Holbein.

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And what Holbein did was paint the Tudor Court. And we think the Tudor Court looks like Holbein tells us.

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We know the story. Catherine of Aragon, here she is. Mary was her only surviving child.

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And the Pope refused an annulment. Which Henry craved because she couldn't produce a boy.

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The result of that was in 1534 he repudiates papal authority. It is all the monasteries.

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1536 over over 600 communities. And yes, like the medieval Catholic Church, they were genuine abuses.

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They were Fat Abbots who lived on the rich of land. But it's a big but.

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Monasteries were the own distributors of medicine and social care. Where did you go if you were ill?

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Where did you go for your poor? Was the local monastery. Also the monasteries have brought about many advances in land management and agricultural techniques.

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We can see that in the post-disolution, the economic health of the country. Decline very quickly.

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And medicine and social care declined. But here's Holbein. It's through Holbein's lens that we see the Tudor Court.

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To Holbein's lens that we think we know what the Tudors look like.

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But like Cranach? Pre ration, Albine is doing. Fairly average religious paintings.

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Here's a last supper. Laid out as a meal. The apostles all the way around Jesus in the center about to break the bread and bless it.

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Of his Judas, Judas is always in yellow for some reason, looking mean and not really part of the group.

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But when the Reformation happens The church is commissioning less and less art. In areas affected by Calvin particularly, the church is commissioning no art.

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Of art is being thrown out of churches. Stained glass windows are being broken, paintings are being burnt.

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So what is an artist to do? Well, a lot of artists like Holbein Turn to portraits.

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Holbein does it in a spectacularly successful way. Here is, here is Thomas More.

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And we could put up dozens of images of the Tudor court painted by Holbein.

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Almost photographically accurate. And whenever we think of the Tudors, where everything of Thomas More and the others, that's what we see in our mind's eye.

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That's what we imagine.

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Here are some more of these time portraits of women. Portrait of Jane Seymour here.

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A couple of women from the court. He manages to capture the character of these people. I he does that really because well he's got to earn a crust somehow.

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And if he's not earning across by painting religious scenes What else can he do? And he's taken under the wing of the Tudor Court and produces these wonderful images.

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This is perhaps his most famous painting. It's the ambassadors it in the National Gallery in London.

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And it carries a very strong symbolic message. These 2 guys are clearly renaissance men.

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And the table is showing the extent of their interests and their abilities. So what do we see on the table?

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What we see a globe. These are men of travel, they know about the world, the world is being explored, it's opening up for the 1st time ever.

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They know about astronomy and time through these instruments. They know about music, they're musicians.

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They have books of mathematics and music they can read.

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That's strange image. Which will come to in a moment. Bye. Might just be a reminder that much of what you see here and they're fine lifestyles are transitory.

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So, here's the globe as they then knew it. These guys travel, they understand the world.

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And that's the image that we see there. It's a strange trick of vision because if you go to the real thing in the National Gallery and look down here somewhere from the bottom right we see a skull.

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It's a Momentimore. It's a reminder that you will die that you will not live forever.

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And in the curtain. There, see, top left. You can just make out. There's half a crucifix.

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What's that about?

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And here is a book of music. And the book of music contains a hymn. And it's a hymn written by Martin Luther.

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Martin Luther the Reformer was a great composer and writer of hymns. Oh and there's an arithmetic book as well.

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So these guys know about mathematics. And there's a loot. If you look closely it doesn't really show in this, this reproduction, the loot has a broken string.

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So what does that all add up to? Well, this painting has had probably more written about it than almost any other painting in history.

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And this is the conclusion. That, art historians come to. There's a crucifix half obscured by the green curtain, symbolizing the division of the church.

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The broken string on the lute. Evokes ecclesiastical disharmony during Reformation.

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The open book of music next to the loot has been identified as a Lutheran hymnal.

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Said Protestant. The book of mathematics is open on a page of division. Which opens with the word . So the theory at least is That whole bind very cleverly.

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He's saying something about the division. Which is caused by the Reformation and is going to be ongoing in England at least.

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Brutally for the rest of the century.

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But how about the ordinary person? How much did they know about all this? Do they carry on the same?

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Or is their worldview absolutely changed? And historians will debate about this. What did the ordinary guy in the pew in say 1450 think about his faith, compared with the ordinary guy a woman in the pew in, compared with the ordinary guy or woman in the pew in, say, 1,600.

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Well, we have one or 2 clues. The Mary Rose sank in 1,455 in the Solent just off Portsmouth where I used to live.

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And on the merry rows there were over 400 rosaries found. Of course the rosary.

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Was the Catholic way of praying. And it suggests that all the ordinary people on the Mary Rose were still saying their prayers in the Catholic way.

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Even though we're about 10 years from Henry's break with Rome. And rosaries weren't, by the way, the most common item on the Mary Rose.

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There was one more common item on the road, May Rose than roses. I mean, somewhat wants to pop that in chat to be interested to see what people think the most common item on the many rows was.

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Here she is being brought up from the scene. 1982 we all saw that and here she is being preserved in Portsmouth dockyard.

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And there's, a memorial to a member of the ship's company of the many rows in Portsmouth Cathedral when, an anonymous sailor was buried there soon after she was raised.

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And there's a rosary from the Mary Rose in beautiful perfect condition. It does show doesn't it how the art and artifacts of a period can ask us lots of religious questions, lots of historical questions, and give us at least partial answers, even not complete answers.

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So that's what was happening in England because of the Reformation. Holbein was doing portraits.

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He was earning a decent living from it. He was showing us what people looked like and he was shaping our view of that Tudor court.

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How about on the continent? We forget the Netherlandish countries. What are the leading artists of the time is Peter Briggel.

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This is thought to be a self-portrait of Bruegel, looking a bit like a scarecrow.

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And this is what he was painting. He wasn't painting overtly religious commissions. Again, the churches, particularly in the Netherlands, have been influenced by Calvin and we're just not buying art.

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But he does paint some interesting proverbs. This is the blind leading the blind. It's, it's a parable from St Matthew's Gospel Chapter 6 when Jesus says if the blide lead the blind then they all fall into the ditch together.

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And broigl has given us an almost comic picture. It's sad as well.

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There's pathos in this of all these people falling into a heap in the ditch. Because all these blind men are being led by a blind man.

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Bruegel also paints a number of mythological subjects. Here is landscape with the fall of Icarus.

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We know the story of Icarus, he's so proud that he makes a wings for himself as feathers and wax flies up to the sun.

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Flies so close that it melts the wax, he falls out of the sky. But where is he?

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We see someone doing some ploughing, someone looking after the sheep, a ship and so on.

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There's Icarus. He's fallen upside down into the sea. Always the main subject of this painting We really have to work quite hard to find him.

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It's almost as if Bruegel is saying, these ordinary people carry on with their work.

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You might have all these exciting mythological or religious things happening around you, but you just don't notice it really.

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And he also paints a lot of Netherlandish proverbs from the time. We don't know what some of them mean.

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And this is titled The Peasant and the Nest Robber. And this guy here is clearly robbing a bird's nest.

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But he's falling out of the tree, he's overbalanced, his hat's falling off, he's fully.

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This, this peasant is pointing to him. And it's clearly telling us something. If you are foolish enough to go robbing birds nests, just look at the consequences of what happens.

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And Bruegel paints a series of the landscape at different times of the year. In doing this, in many ways he's copying what some of the miniatureists were doing a century or so earlier.

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Some of the books of hours that were being done, particularly in France, painted scenes of everyday life and they cycle of the seasons.

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And Broadly is doing that but on a big scale. It's thought that there were 12 of these, probably only 6 of them still exist.

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But here's the harvest. And Braggly showing us that instead of just being interested in saints.

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In Jesus and Mary in the myths of the past. It's worth painting ordinary people. Worth painting these peasants doing their work.

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Resting after a day harvesting and having a few beers. And Broadly bringing into the centre of art.

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Not just the aristocracy. As Holbein was. But the ordinary workers. And at the same time is developing for the 1st time perhaps in art and interest in landscape.

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Landscape is very much a post-reformation art form.

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And this is the beginnings really of some of those winter landscapes that we find in the Dutch painters of the 17th century.

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All those painters of skaters. Of people snowballing, of Dutch villages under the snow.

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They all really begin here with Bruegel. And what Brokeley is having to do all the time is to find a different way of doing art.

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And here at about the same time. And there are some theories by some people this work is done by Brueghel.

00:29:43.000 --> 00:29:47.000
Is the master of the small landscapes. We don't know who he was, he's anonymous.

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It's a book of 44 prints. Published around 1560. The preface says altogether drawn from life and primarily around Antwerp.

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And these are close up. I high high level renderings of identifiable places. They're very much linked to later Dutch painting, 17th century painting and and perhaps were the beginning of that tradition.

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Just look at a couple of them. Just astonishing detail. Astonishing sketch work. Made possible of course by printing.

00:30:23.000 --> 00:30:29.000
Because these are printed. But also for the 1st time ever perhaps showing an interest and a curiosity about the dwellings and the occupation.

00:30:29.000 --> 00:30:55.000
And the living places of ordinary people. No saints, no religious imagery. Although perhaps there is something of the holiness about place that becomes interesting and important aspect of landscape painting.

00:30:55.000 --> 00:31:02.000
Is another one. Most of these, by the way, have very few people in them, just a fisherman here.

00:31:02.000 --> 00:31:13.000
I'm here one or 2 people and these people are really quite small and significant when compared with the trees and the houses and so on as they go about their business.

00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:24.000
But an astonishing eye for detail here and saying for the 1st time really it's worth recording where these people lived.

00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:30.000
Where they were sorts of buildings they inhabited.

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But then of course the Catholic Church fought back. And the death of religious art. At the time of the Reformation.

00:31:40.000 --> 00:31:45.000
Provoked what is sometimes termed the counter reformation. Fight back. And that happened in lots of different ways.

00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:59.000
In in Paris in the 15 thirtys There were riots in the streets. And the riots were about the meaning of the mass.

00:31:59.000 --> 00:32:08.000
The communion service, the, the, the, Eucharist. And people were rioting because they didn't want them mass.

00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:16.000
To be reformed. They wanted what they'd originally had and reformers were trying to convince them it needed to change.

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They called Hocus Pocus riots. Because at the moment the priest consecrates the bread and the wine at the mouse.

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He says, hawk s corpus mayhem in Latin. Okus corpus mayam, this is my body.

00:32:31.000 --> 00:32:36.000
And if you say quickly enough lots of times, Hawking's corpus may, okay, it comes out as hocus pocus.

00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:43.000
That's what they were called. The bishops all got together. 15 sixties in Trento in northern Italy.

00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:50.000
And condemned the Reformation. And then there's the influence of Teresa and the Jesuits.

00:32:50.000 --> 00:33:00.000
Because they were shifting the Catholic Church. Into another sort of Reformation. They were trying to bring back.

00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:17.000
Feeling into the Christian faith. They're trying to bring back the response of the emotions. Rather than just of the intellect because they saw the Reformation with its emphasis on the Bible and on the Word of God and on preaching.

00:33:17.000 --> 00:33:21.000
They saw it as an overintellectual movement.

00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:30.000
Here's Benini. This is a sculpture in the Jesuit church in Rome. Done in about, when you see these dates there.

00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:37.000
I'm called the ecstasy of St. Theresa. Take Theresa as a Spanish nun.

00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:55.000
Who wrote about her own deep religious emotional experiences. And in one of her meditations describes how an angel was sent by God and with his arrow pierced her to such an extent that she went into ecstatic vision.

00:33:55.000 --> 00:34:05.000
Now clearly there's a lot of sexual imagery going on here. But also it's saying This is the effect of Christianity.

00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:16.000
It's not just going to church with a black Bible under your arm. There's really motion involved here, real transformation involved here.

00:34:16.000 --> 00:34:23.000
And that leads to what we know as Baroque art. Something which is brimming with intense emotion.

00:34:23.000 --> 00:34:43.000
Has a real sense of movement. And has a close link to the Counter Reformation because the bishops of the church as we approach 1,600 are more and more encouraging artists who they approach 1,600 are more and more encouraging artists who they are commissioning to paint in a way that moves the masses to devotion, more and more encouraging artists who they are commissioning to paint in a way that moves the masses to

00:34:43.000 --> 00:34:47.000
devotion. And here's the big daddy of them all. Caravaggio.

00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:53.000
This is his supper, Imeas from 16 0 1.

00:34:53.000 --> 00:35:04.000
Now this has changed in enormously. From how artists were painting before the Reformation. Remember back to that Van Eye Goldterpiece and that enunciation by Botticelli.

00:35:04.000 --> 00:35:14.000
This is the suppatimaeus. You remember the story that Jesus after his resurrection is walking along the road with 2 of his disciples who don't recognize him.

00:35:14.000 --> 00:35:24.000
He tells them the story of the crucifixion and resurrection. They invite him in for supper and at the moment that he blesses the meal and breaks the bread, they recognize him.

00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:30.000
And this is the moment of recognition. This man is about to spring up as he recognises his Jesus.

00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:40.000
This man holds his arms apart in wonder. The servant looks on bemused. I just love the the worn-out.

00:35:40.000 --> 00:35:43.000
Elbow in this jumper that he's wearing.

00:35:43.000 --> 00:35:51.000
Cannobaggio is drawing us into the painting. There's a 4th side to this table.

00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:56.000
And I am invited to sit on this side of the table. I'm invited to join this meal.

00:35:56.000 --> 00:36:09.000
I'm invited to see what's happening when Jesus reveals himself. I can almost as I like to say when I'm looking at Calavaggio sometimes I can almost smell the garlic on their breaths in this painting.

00:36:09.000 --> 00:36:15.000
I can't stand back from this and remain unaffected by it.

00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:16.000
And here's another Caravaggio and I saw this only a few weeks ago in Malta.

00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:25.000
I haven't seen it before. I mean, I've seen reproductions but not the real thing on holiday in Malta.

00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:32.000
This is in Malta Cathedral. It is huge, it's about 18 feet across. It's the beheading of John the Baptist.

00:36:32.000 --> 00:36:41.000
Caravaggio is trying to involve us in this. Religion isn't something you stand back from and observe from a distance.

00:36:41.000 --> 00:36:47.000
It's something you have to take sides about. It's something got to be involved in.

00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:57.000
And here's Caribaggio's painting of, David. Having defeated Goliath beheading Goliath.

00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:06.000
And as we might know, that is actually a self portrait of Caravaggio. Is that an aive painting or is it not?

00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:15.000
And in the north where they still weren't being commissioned much to paint religious paintings. The artists were doing something slightly different.

00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:23.000
They were painting scenes of everyday life, landscapes, civic life, and of course the great masters are Rubens and Rembrandt and Vermeer.

00:37:23.000 --> 00:37:30.000
I'm here Rembrandt painted his own portrait well well over 30 times that we're aware of.

00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:39.000
But he also painted the civic life of Amsterdam. Here is the night watch. Those who looked after the city after dog.

00:37:39.000 --> 00:37:46.000
Each of these a portrait. This is the syndic of the cloth makers guild.

00:37:46.000 --> 00:37:48.000
When Rembrandt was at the height of his fame, although he went bankrupt a couple of times, his popularity went up and down.

00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:58.000
We're at the height all of the guilds in the city wanted their portraits done.

00:37:58.000 --> 00:38:08.000
So they clubbed together, they buy the portrait, they would, exhibit this in the guild headquarters and Rembrandt was making quite a good living at this.

00:38:08.000 --> 00:38:17.000
In a sense doing what Holbein had been doing a century and a bit earlier in England. But he does some really does paintings.

00:38:17.000 --> 00:38:28.000
But see how they change, see how different they are. Their religious paintings which include ordinary people. Here is Matthew.

00:38:28.000 --> 00:38:37.000
Writing his gospel. And at his ear an angel is dictating to him. No haloes.

00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:46.000
No holy bits in the painting. It could be any man writing a book with someone whispering in his ear.

00:38:46.000 --> 00:38:52.000
And here's the prodigal son. In a tavern, living it up.

00:38:52.000 --> 00:39:01.000
Having a great time. Again, this could be a painting not necessarily with religious theme at all. It could just be a painting of a tavern somewhere in Amsterdam.

00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:16.000
Somewhere around 1650. So the way of depicting religious scenes has undergone a huge transformation between about 1,000. 501,600.

00:39:16.000 --> 00:39:18.000
This is my favorite Remand. This is the return of the prodigal son. It's in some Petersburg in the air.

00:39:18.000 --> 00:39:34.000
And unfortunately, so fragile it will never move. But here is the father. Welcoming back the sun.

00:39:34.000 --> 00:39:44.000
Returned having spent half the fortune wasted on women wine and song and comes back to beg his father's forgiveness.

00:39:44.000 --> 00:39:57.000
And then. To shift it all on another stage really. Is Johannes Blemia who has become astonishingly fashionable in odd circles in the last couple of decades.

00:39:57.000 --> 00:40:14.000
A very few paintings survive, maybe 34. And he paints intense domesticity. Simon Sharma says this, almost all his paintings are apparently setting 2 small rooms in his house in Delft.

00:40:14.000 --> 00:40:25.000
They show the same furniture and decorations in various arrangements and they often portray the same people. Mostly women.

00:40:25.000 --> 00:40:35.000
So art. In a sense, when we come to Vermeer, a shrunk. We began this lecture in looking at that huge altarpiece by Van Eyck.

00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:46.000
The beginning of time to the end the creation and fall of Adam to the coming together of all creation around the altar at the end of the book of Revelation.

00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:53.000
He's encapsulating the whole of religious history, the whole of the Bible, in that one huge altarpiece.

00:40:53.000 --> 00:41:01.000
By the time we get here to the second half of the 17th century. We've sort of contracted things.

00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:08.000
Yes, Dutch artists are doing those big landscapes, but actually most of them are quite small pictures.

00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:23.000
There may be 1824 inches across. They're containing the landscape within those. And, is going even on a smaller scale than that because he concentrates on the people he knows.

00:41:23.000 --> 00:41:31.000
Those around him. This is made in the dairy, I'm making a milk pudding or whatever she's doing.

00:41:31.000 --> 00:41:42.000
Or here the famous girl with the pearl earring. Concentrate as pretty specifically on this person as an individual human being.

00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:46.000
And here, well, is this Vermeer himself? Here is the artist. Painting a girl holding a trumpet or trumpet without valves and so on.

00:41:46.000 --> 00:42:04.000
Interestingly on the wall is a map of the world. Because Amsterdam at that time was probably the center of trading between Europe and America.

00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:15.000
So we've come for circle as it were. We've begun with those religious paintings. Of the 14, th 15th centuries.

00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:24.000
We've shifted through the great upheaval brought about by Luther and Calvin and we've looked at the ways in which that affected art.

00:42:24.000 --> 00:42:36.000
How, once church is certainly in northern Europe, we're no longer commissioning major art pieces. From that time on, artists had to find something else to do.

00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:45.000
Holbein found portraits. Bruegel found peasants. Lot of Dutch artists found landscapes.

00:42:45.000 --> 00:42:53.000
Vermeer, he concentrated and he brought art very much into the domestic setting.

00:42:53.000 --> 00:43:02.000
So Fiona. I shall stop.

00:43:02.000 --> 00:43:03.000
Okay.

00:43:03.000 --> 00:43:08.000
Thanks very much David. We will go straight to some questions. And I don't know if you were having a little look at the chat to see people suggestions for the most commonly found.

00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:09.000
It's

00:43:09.000 --> 00:43:15.000
No, no, I, I wasn't unfortunate. I can't, multitask.

00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:16.000
Yeah, okay.

00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:21.000
Shall we, shall we quickly do that 1st then? So I'll just read out a few of the suggestions.

00:43:21.000 --> 00:43:22.000
Hey, yeah.

00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:24.000
And then you can clarify it for everybody. 1st one, top for a run?

00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:35.000
Yep. Wasn't it? There were there were there were Over 550 nitcombs on the very rows.

00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:36.000
There we go.

00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:39.000
There were more, there were more nitcomes than there were sailors. Just gives you a wonderful insight into Tudor life.

00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:42.000
Doesn't it? Yeah.

00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:53.000
It does. It does. Okay, now let me find the questions again for you. We do have some.

00:43:53.000 --> 00:44:06.000
No, weird idea. Got lots of comments and chat here. Right, here we are. Find them.

00:44:06.000 --> 00:44:07.000
Okay.

00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:11.000
Most of the questions I've got so far are about. And from, existing.

00:44:11.000 --> 00:44:15.000
Obviously talking about we saw some of those sort of Dutch winter scenes.

00:44:15.000 --> 00:44:17.000
Yeah.

00:44:17.000 --> 00:44:25.000
Was it very cold at that point in the 17th century? To sort of prompt those kinds of scenes.

00:44:25.000 --> 00:44:34.000
Yeah, I suspect, well, 2 things prompt them. One thing is that Holland was expanding.

00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:39.000
And as you might know, a lot of, lot of Dutch territories reclaimed from the sea.

00:44:39.000 --> 00:44:49.000
And between about 1,51650. The amount of land in Holland expanded by 50 or 60%.

00:44:49.000 --> 00:44:57.000
Others might know more about this than I do. Partly because of draining land. And what was at the center of that was windmills.

00:44:57.000 --> 00:45:08.000
So the windmill became the symbol of Holland. But in terms of winters, I believe that there was and what is sometimes called a little ice age.

00:45:08.000 --> 00:45:23.000
And that was, particularly present in northern Europe. Therefore Holland was experiencing colder winters between so like 1515, 1650, which is when we get those paintings.

00:45:23.000 --> 00:45:29.000
Was experienced a little later in this country when of course we had those famous frozen fairs on the Thames.

00:45:29.000 --> 00:45:37.000
So, we have been through some cold periods and I think Bruegel and others were showing that in their paintings, yes.

00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:46.000
Okay, there we go, Christine. Right, there was another question about, Barogel.

00:45:46.000 --> 00:45:51.000
Let me try and find it again. Gillian is asking who is Briggle selling to?

00:45:51.000 --> 00:45:53.000
Wealthy merchants question mark.

00:45:53.000 --> 00:46:06.000
Yeah, mostly wealthy merchants. We're not sure is the answer to that. What we do know is that Amsterdam was, a major art market.

00:46:06.000 --> 00:46:19.000
And so was Antwerp. And so was Bruce. And we know that about by about 1,600, little bit after Boyle, by about 1,600 if you went round the Amsterdam and the Antwerp markets on a Saturday.

00:46:19.000 --> 00:46:30.000
There were lots of art stalls and you could buy paintings. That's part of the reason why a lot of those, those later landscapes are not really big.

00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:40.000
They're 24 inches across. They're domestic. So a lot of painting at the time was aimed at the domestic market because the church market didn't exist in northern Europe.

00:46:40.000 --> 00:46:57.000
But yeah, wealthy merchants were certainly the answer to who was buying Brigal. And, and, and, and interestingly, as Amsterdam became richer because of its trading, particularly of tobacco and sugar and so on.

00:46:57.000 --> 00:47:05.000
So the merchants were buying more and more art. And having art was away firstly saying how rich you were.

00:47:05.000 --> 00:47:14.000
And also showing how cultured you were. So you'd invite your neighbors for dinner. And you might have a broggle on the wall.

00:47:14.000 --> 00:47:28.000
And they're impressed because you're wealthy and you're cultured. And, and with, with art always through history, who's buying this stuff and why is a really interesting way to follow the art?

00:47:28.000 --> 00:47:33.000
Hey, there we go, Gillian. Right, we've got it's not so much of a question.

00:47:33.000 --> 00:47:37.000
It's more of a comment, but I'm sure you'll have some thoughts on this.

00:47:37.000 --> 00:47:38.000
Yeah.

00:47:38.000 --> 00:47:50.000
It's from Madeline and she's talking about a wonderful Bruegel export in Brussels a number of years ago.

00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:51.000
Yeah.

00:47:51.000 --> 00:48:01.000
With multiple copies of the same subjects including the winter village with the frozen river, and it shorts how, The, make multiple copies of the same picture using a kind of stencil.

00:48:01.000 --> 00:48:07.000
And put something like charcoal powder was sprinkled to give the outlines of the main parts of the picture.

00:48:07.000 --> 00:48:08.000
Yep. Yep.

00:48:08.000 --> 00:48:16.000
And so the staff could paint the boring bits and the boss could do the important bits. I don't know if you can sort of talk about that.

00:48:16.000 --> 00:48:21.000
Yeah, a lot of that was done by Bruegel's son. Oigel the younger.

00:48:21.000 --> 00:48:33.000
So peederborg, the elder was the creative guy really. And when he died, his son was, I think, say like 5 or 6, not really old at all.

00:48:33.000 --> 00:48:35.000
But broicolic got a workshop. And a lot of the workshop was copying his paintings.

00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:52.000
Now when his son took over He started a huge industry. Copying his father's paintings. And the way they did that and this had been, you know, way back this was done by Rafael and so on.

00:48:52.000 --> 00:48:59.000
Is that you do it on paper. So, Peter Boyd will be younger, would copy his father's paintings on paper.

00:48:59.000 --> 00:49:06.000
They put lots of little print pricks in it. Put it on a canvas and blow powder through the holes.

00:49:06.000 --> 00:49:13.000
Something like talcum powder really some sort of some sort of you know often brown down wide chalk dust.

00:49:13.000 --> 00:49:18.000
And then assistants and apprentices could paint around the outlines and fill it in. So you get multiple copies of some of those.

00:49:18.000 --> 00:49:26.000
Usually the copy is done by his son and his workshop.

00:49:26.000 --> 00:49:32.000
Okay, there we go, Madeline. Right, okay, I've got another couple of questions.

00:49:32.000 --> 00:49:45.000
Let me just scroll down and find them. This is from Elizabeth. She's asking, did manadism affect reformation art?

00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:56.000
It's a difficult question, isn't it, all the other way round? I mean, mannerism was a form of art which was sort of leading up to leading up to the Baroque.

00:49:56.000 --> 00:50:07.000
In which the figures are much more sort of contorted. Often elongated. Variety of subjects in it.

00:50:07.000 --> 00:50:14.000
But I, I mean, I think, I think a lot of art historians would regard mannerism as an early form of Baroque.

00:50:14.000 --> 00:50:26.000
And certainly the manorists who were painting with religious subjects in them and the work were quite a lot, were were much influenced by the counterreformation I think.

00:50:26.000 --> 00:50:30.000
It's not a very good answer, but I don't know enough about it. So.

00:50:30.000 --> 00:50:31.000
Okay.

00:50:31.000 --> 00:50:35.000
I'm, I, I might look up some of that, in the, in the text to you tomorrow.

00:50:35.000 --> 00:50:45.000
Sure. Okay, right. I have another question here from Stuart. And I think you may have touched on this a little bit in what you were saying earlier.

00:50:45.000 --> 00:50:54.000
He's asking, did interest in art expand to be more popular with its conveyance be a printing, an expansion to the middle classes perhaps.

00:50:54.000 --> 00:50:58.000
Was there any art for the ordinary folks?

00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:07.000
Yes, is the answer the 1st bit. I mean, by about 1,500. A number of artists getting interest in printing.

00:51:07.000 --> 00:51:18.000
The most obvious one was Dura. I'll break Dura was by 1,500 or so selling lots of prints of his work.

00:51:18.000 --> 00:51:26.000
And of course this has a huge advantage. Because I can sell you one painting. I can sell to 500 people if I print it.

00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:37.000
So, so print is becoming an art medium in its own right by about 1,500. And obviously it's a medium that has its own challenges and its own advantages.

00:51:37.000 --> 00:51:41.000
So, yes, that was that was certainly happening. And, and, and it was certainly a method of disseminating information.

00:51:41.000 --> 00:51:57.000
Very quickly. And ideas very quickly. So printing becomes a central piece of art, a central, central medium for art.

00:51:57.000 --> 00:52:10.000
And of course it's cheap. So ordinary people can buy it. And along with the sorts of small landscapes that Dutch artists are doing a century later.

00:52:10.000 --> 00:52:18.000
It means that art can become the possession of because they the ordinary merchant wouldn't, wouldn't be the ordinary peasants.

00:52:18.000 --> 00:52:27.000
But those there's an interesting piece of travel writing by an Englishman who went to Holland in a ballet in about 1650.

00:52:27.000 --> 00:52:35.000
Who said every merchant has got a painting on his wall. Now this was obviously a surprise to this traveler.

00:52:35.000 --> 00:52:49.000
But yeah, they could they could buy paintings they weren't they weren't expensive so so art becomes something that everyone can see But until then, of course, until the Reformation, the only art you could see was in church.

00:52:49.000 --> 00:52:58.000
Unless you were a Medici, you know, commissioned your own, the only art you could really, if you're a peasant, could look at was in your local church.

00:52:58.000 --> 00:53:11.000
And once that declined in Northern Europe. So ordinary people started wanting to buy some art. Hey, it wasn't until major art galleries started to open.

00:53:11.000 --> 00:53:19.000
That the ordinary person could see what we might call great art. This year is the 200th anniversary of the National Gallery opening.

00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:46.000
Opened at 1824. Until then. And yet the ordinary person would only say art. If in church, if there was any left in churches in this country, which there wasn't much then, or if he or she happened to be a servant in the great house but oh you wouldn't see any So in the galleries open art becomes a whole new story when when when places like Nash Gallery open

00:53:46.000 --> 00:53:54.000
Okay, right. I am going to ask a quick question if that's all right, just to finish this off.

00:53:54.000 --> 00:53:55.000
Of course.

00:53:55.000 --> 00:54:01.000
And kind of all of all the sort of reformation art that we've looked at. Do you have a personal favorite?

00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:02.000
Yeah.

00:54:02.000 --> 00:54:05.000
Oh, Brogel, got to be, Broadle such fun.

00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:10.000
Okay, right everybody. Thanks very much for that David. Really interesting.

00:54:10.000 --> 00:54:19.000
Some amazing paintings and images. And certainly, you know, the Reformation had such a big impact.

00:54:19.000 --> 00:54:25.000
Across life in general and we can absolutely see how this was reflected in the art of the time can't we?

00:54:25.000 --> 00:54:27.000
And so thank you very much for taking us all through it.

00:54:27.000 --> 00:54:36.000
Bye, I'm just looking at all the suggestions of what they most common item on the Mary Rose what's fascinating isn't it?

00:54:36.000 --> 00:54:37.000
Thank you.

00:54:37.000 --> 00:54:40.000
Yeah, yeah, I'll send those to you tomorrow as well, David. Okay, so I hope everyone out there.

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:53.000
Hope you enjoyed that. And obviously look out for your email tomorrow, which will have some details of some WAA art courses coming up, and that you might be interested in if you enjoyed the session today.

00:54:53.000 --> 00:55:00.000
So once again, and thank you very much, David.

00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:11.000
Thank you Fiona. If I can just share my screen.

00:00:11.000 --> 00:00:18.000
There we go. Hope everyone can see this. So good afternoon everyone. I've called this lecture satire and syllabub.

00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:27.000
There are many things I could have called it and I've chosen for this page a Gillery cartoon of a couple of military men, one of them as you can see on the left is just a boy enjoying sweet treats as a famous confectioner, something very fashionable in 1,797.

00:00:27.000 --> 00:00:41.000
And the one on the right is eating syllabub, which is the main reason I put that particular cartoon on my title page.

00:00:41.000 --> 00:00:53.000
Well come back to Silverb and many other foods later but meanwhile the subtitle of the lecture, Food History in the Age of Caricature, begs the question, when was the age of caricature?

00:00:53.000 --> 00:01:17.000
Well, neatly, it more or less coincides with what historians call the long regency, the actual regency of course was only 9 years long and here is George the principal ails by Sir Thomas Lawrence there on the right very much as he would like to see himself was since he, Gilroy and others chose to depict him, which is nothing like so noble or indeed so slim.

00:01:17.000 --> 00:01:24.000
So what are the dominant images of this period? Well, we can begin grimly with the guillotine in the French Revolution.

00:01:24.000 --> 00:01:47.000
We can move on to the period of the Napoleonic Wars that followed with Napoleon on the right and Wellington on the left, his nemesis at Waterloo, or we can picture one of several other revolutions, the Industrial Revolution, for example, which in itself had a huge effect on what people ate as they moved from the countryside to the rapidly expanding cities such as

00:01:47.000 --> 00:01:55.000
Manchester. Okay. Or we can picture a different kind of revolution, the literary revolution of the romantic movement.

00:01:55.000 --> 00:02:04.000
Or indeed we can talk about the growth of popular unrest that culminated in the Peterloo massacre of 1,819.

00:02:04.000 --> 00:02:05.000
A bit more about that later. The other extreme and it was an age of extremes. I've come onto that too.

00:02:05.000 --> 00:02:18.000
This was the so-called age of elegance, of fine architecture that the the crescent at bath furniture and costumes that even now are a huge attraction.

00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:32.000
And probably half the appeal and program like Bridgeton consists in his costumes. It was an age when women have virtually no distinct legal identity and very few prospects beyond marriage.

00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:49.000
And yet it was an era of huge female achievement. Mary Wilsoncraft, proto feminist, Jane Austen herself of course, Mary Annning, in paleontology, Caroline Herschel, the astronomer.

00:02:49.000 --> 00:03:14.000
I'll come back of course to Jane Austen later on. Enormous freedoms were gained in this period but also a great deal was lost and the 1st main cartoon I'm going to feature there is that of what should be the 6 acts not the seek acts of 1819 where you've got the prime minister for a actually sitting on a man who represents the ordinary citizen and all his 5 senses have been shut down by

00:03:14.000 --> 00:03:25.000
these acts which included, among other things, attacks on newspapers to seditious material getting through to ordinary people.

00:03:25.000 --> 00:03:31.000
You'll notice and you'll notice again and again that there is tiny writing on lots of these cartoons.

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I'm not going to read it all out. It's an advantage that you can go back to the recordings.

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I will just highlight certain things that are important. So, back to extremes and one of the most noticeable, I suppose, was the way people prepared and their food.

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This is the kitchen. The the revolutionary kitchen in itself at the Royal Pavilion in Brighton.

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It had charcoal ovens, hundreds of servants, George himself, the Prince Regent. It was his pride and joy and he would show people around aristocratic people naturally.

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He would show people around himself. He was very proud of his banquets. This is one from 1817, presided over by his chef, Antonin Karem, one of the 1st what you might call celebrity chefs.

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You've got a huge obscene one might think amounts of food there, 40 entrees around the fish, the fish dish in clip.

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Fish dishes include things like the head of a great stir, surge sturgeon in champagne, the on train, tart of thrushes, a grata, a dessert of an orange liqueur jelly and the centrepiece the Royal Pavilion rendered in pastry.

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Again, if you can see this, if you can make it big enough, this is a fascinating menu, but also slightly disgusting that they would want to eat so many.

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There were a lot of guests of course. There is very little wastage in Georgian food in that what wasn't eaten by the guests went to the servants and wasn't eaten by the servants went to the poor.

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So they did have that over us.

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The Prince Regents extravagance in his celebrating his own birthday was also quite notorious. This is 1,812 George Crookshank who's showing us his birthday party and for the 1st time in these cartoons we can actually see there some ordinary people not just ordinary but starving and the injustice that they feel about the way they are treated.

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The poor man outside is saying if rich rogues like poor ones were to hang it would thin the land such numbers would swing upon Tyburn tree.

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The quote in the middle, what think you of the bubbling brooks and mossy backs at Carlton House, the Prince Regent actually installed a stream full of fish that ran through his dining room.

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This is said this entertainment will cost 120,000 pounds and you multiply by something like 60 to get a modern equivalent he says nor will it be the last baubel which the nation must buy to amuse this overgrown bantling of regency.

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This was Shelley the poet. Commenting on this party. Luckily for him, he was in Italy beyond the reach of the laws of sedition.

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Cook's shank also showed that the war itself, no matter how prosperous you were to start with, could reduce you to penury.

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So the subtitles there are before the war where you know the head of the family. As always with these pictures looking obscenely fat is ladling something into his mouth.

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There is a well fed dog even in the foreground. During the war they still look okay but things are not quite so good.

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The joint is getting a little bit thin and he is complaining and saying oh for a piece a lasting and permanent piece but of course Waterloo didn't bring prosperity.

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It brought, if anything, more poverty as soldiers returned to the country. And needed to find. Something to sustain then.

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So peace with all the world, leads to mere bones on the table. He's actually saying at 1 point, more bones child and the starving child is saying, give me some more bone daddy.

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So exaggerated of course but you know. Cartoonists as always had their finger on the pulse.

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So a very famous cartoon just for us to look at in a little bit more detail is this one, the Prince Regent, age 30.

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In 1792 and it's called of a luxury under the horrors of digestion.

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I've shown the detail there so you can see his bulging waistcoat. At his pocket he's got a corkscrew obviously very handy and I think a little nutmeg grater and a key probably to the wine cupboard.

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He's picking his teeth with a fork. His manners were commented on at the time and behind him there, worst of all, there is an overflowing chamber pot and a great shelf of medicines, patent medicines for things like gout and indigestion.

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The sort of diseases and the sort of complaints that rich Georgians went to Bath to be cured of but George suffered from them in spades.

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There he is again and you can see those all those medicines and and the way he's busting out of his clothes.

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And this is a wonderfully good example of James Gilroy in James Gilroy's work.

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It has has to be our starting point because it's so so well drawn. You might say work about he's using a fine stipple that was normally reserved for for flattering portraits, not for cartoons.

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It's totally unsparing, they didn't spare anybody, they seem to get away with it, I'll come back to that too.

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And it shows very typically a comic distaste for bodies and what we put into them. You know.

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They are full of disgust and distaste as well as laughter. Food and drink very important otherwise I perhaps wouldn't have chosen this topic but ironically Gilroy was much admired by the prince.

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The principal large quantities of his work and was very proud of them. Perhaps on the same basis that politicians during the heyday of spitting image were slightly insulted if they were caricatured on spitting image.

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They felt neglected that they couldn't be very important. So maybe that was partly the reason. Here is Gilbert.

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Drew and published something like a thousand drawings and cartoons caricatures. They would have been black and white.

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He would have done just one in color and then he would have had a almost like a factory of colorists to color them in, which is sometimes why online they look slightly different.

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The colors in each one look slightly different. If you want a good read about this, which is quite recent, I think it was last year, Alice Lockton's uproar, satire scandal and printmakers in Georgia and London is a really good read about Gil, Rowlandson and the 2 Crookshanks father and son.

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Gueray came to quite a sad end in that he began to lose his sight, which is a horrible thing for any artist and eventually after an attempted suicide he died in his late fiftys in some despair.

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But at the time, the golden age of caricature, he was perhaps the star. He lived with Hannah Humphrey, whose print shop was perhaps the most popular in London.

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And what was new about these caricature was unlike say a hogarth, they represented real recognizable people.

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Though if you didn't use the name of the real person in the cartoon, then it was very difficult to prosecute you for libel.

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They were popular, they were easily obtained. You can see in the picture that people are crowding round the print shop and you can recognize some of those cartoons.

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They were too expensive for the masses. A, a black and white ones, a shilling. 2 shillings coloured but nevertheless you know if you're a middle class after sound perhaps you could aspire to collect them.

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So they were difficult to suppress compared with literature. Those who disliked being caricaturous would sometimes buy up all the stocks or a political party would bribe the artist.

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Guy is often accused of going over to the Tories for money. Is Mrs. Humphrey's print shop?

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And again, you can see how popular they were or a reputed to be. Everybody is crowding around to see how popular they were or reputed to be.

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Everybody is crowding around to see the latest caricatures and inside there are 2 men laughing at a particular one.

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I wonder if they are perhaps people who are making money out of these. Very slippy weather, which we've glimpsed before, shows a man falling on the pavement outside the shop.

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He's probably an amateur weather forecaster. He's got his barometer, his, his temperature, his thermometer in his hand and everybody else is ignoring him.

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So, back to food then. Whether you ate too much or you ate too little, the caricaturist could make you look ridiculous.

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And this applied to the King and Queen, George the 3, rd who of course for much of this period.

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Was had lost his sanity, we still don't know quite what was wrong with him, but he was, at Windsor, more or less under confinement.

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But at this stage, 1792, he's pictured with the Queen. Enjoyed as temperance enjoying a frugal meal.

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It looks quite nice. It looks quite nutritious to us. He's eating a boiled egg.

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And the Queen is eating a bowl of greens, greens which we'll see again and seem to be associated with how they pitch in sauerkraut.

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You know, alluding to her German origins. But there are lots of little clues as the rows are with the caricatures in this picture.

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The king has tucked the tablecloth into his collar to keep his clothes clean. His Chair is covered with something to keep it clean.

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Even the bell pull has got a little bag on it so that it doesn't suffer wear and tear.

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We can see from what's in the fireplace, it's not a fire, but the holly, the holly and and ivy and the snowdrops suggest it's the middle of winter.

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And on the table there there are there's a life of a miser and the benefits of a sparing diet.

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So it's suggesting along with the character over the carving over the fire. The chair up there has got his hands in a great big, so it's a very cold room that they are sitting in.

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Yes, there, there are a few notes there, the weighing scales and the stock strong room behind suggests that they're living ousterely but actually they're holding money.

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This idea that the royal family shouldn't be too lavish, but they should live appropriately. Surfaced with the late Queen Elizabeth, I don't know if you remember at one stage there were newspaper articles talking about her use of Tupperware and the fact that she had cheaper electric fires that she would burn rather than have the the fires at Buckingham Palace.

00:14:19.000 --> 00:14:24.000
And even in 2,023 where we have Charles on the throne of course we have this article in the mirror its members are surprisingly frugal in their everyday duties.

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Not quite disapproved of, perhaps, but seems surprising and the Georgians were snobs about their royalty.

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They wanted them to live well, but not as well as the Prince Regent. Here are George and Charlotte again and this one is nice because we don't get many pictures or caricatures of ordinary people cooking ordinary food.

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But here in 1791 we have the Queen frying sprats on little griddle over the open fire.

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And George toasting a muffin. Presumably for his breakfast. And they both look, I think they generate a certain amount of affection here they look so much as though they're going to enjoy their their their modest diet.

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And

00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:24.000
They're also associated with a popular movement. Well, perhaps not popular. Apparently about 40,000 people.

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Anti-saccharides. It's part of the abolitionist movement to draw attention to the fact that sugar is a major import, which it owes its existence really to to slavery.

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But the Queen has her daughters around her. I mean they were they were a huge family. With a lot of daughters but the daughters are making a face and Queen Charlotte is saying, Oh my dear creatures do but taste it.

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You can't think how nice it is without sugar, hardly anybody drank tea without sugar. And then consider how much work you'll save the poor blacky boys by leaving off the use of it.

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And above all, remember how much expense it will save your poor papa. Oh, it's a charming, cooling drink.

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So a typical kind of satire here. We're saying 1st of all making us think that the Queen and King are on the side of the angels in barring sugar and then it turns out they are doing it again just the same money.

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There's no indication that any of this is justified, but that's caricatures for you.

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They would have cut off their sugar with sugar nips of course, it would have come as a loaf and just a sideline about sugar, sugar consumption over time.

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If you can see there, if you look at 1,800, it's pretty modest, but by 2,000 there is a huge rise.

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And even at that time it increased fivefold. And it was an important product of slavery. In 1715 earlier on Thomas Slayer defended its use and reclaimed its health benefits.

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I put that in a vindication of sugars because he's talking about the great Duke of Beaufort who he tells us for near 40 years he had used near a pound of sugar a day in his sherry chocolate and sweetmeats which he did eat constantly after dinner.

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Apparently the average now which is more than far more than we need is 55 grams. Certainly not a pound.

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We don't get much indication of what was going on in the kitchens where people were producing these huge feasts.

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But we do have a popular fast by James Townley in 17 in 1759 a play called high life below stairs I think that might have been the 1st time that the phrase below stairs.

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I think that might have been the 1st time that the phrase below stairs was used. I think that might have been the 1st time that the phrase below stairs was used.

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I think that might have been the 1st time that the phrase below stairs was used and the actors there, the servants go almost on strike.

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Here they are arguing about who is going to answer the door. There, you'd be interested there to see a black what seems to be a black actor.

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It would have been a white man in a black face but there were quite a lot of black servants. Some paid.

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And some virtually enslaved. Even in Britain. The fact that this was a popular play is shown by the fact that the Prince Regent again was pilloried about his behavior at the What is called here the Theatre Royal Brighton, a new farce for the education and amusement of the cooks, scullions, dishwashers, lick trenches, shoe blacks, cinder

00:18:29.000 --> 00:18:36.000
sifters, candles snuffers, etc. Of that theater which was unfortunately down the 1st night by common sense.

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So the theater of the Prince Regents life I think is the subject of mockery here and the waste of food.

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But we do actually see some servants in the background.

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It reminds us of very early in the Georgian period, before our period really, Jonathan Swift wrote something called directions to servants, all of which is very funny and very ironic.

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The advice here is while your master is saying grace, take the chairs from behind the company and go out so everything collapses and these huge terrains are being spilt all over.

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If you look at these, if you have a chance to go through them later, there is almost always a dog in the foreground.

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Chewing on something, sometimes a cat as well. And that's no exception.

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The Prince Regent was constantly advised as far as one could advise royalty to to cut back on his expenditure.

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I think he's got his foot. Bound up like that because of the gout you separate from the gout.

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And here, Lord Browne, I don't know how you pronounce it quite, the Chancellor of the Exchequer is appearing with a new broom.

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He was, I think, just recently appointed. But he's also a kind of John Bull figure.

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This is 1816 and his words to the Prince Regent who has got this huge bowl of punch on the table is saying retrench retrench.

00:19:59.000 --> 00:20:10.000
Which again is a word that you used oddly at the beginning of Jane Austen's persuasion of the same year where the family have to give up their stately home and go and live in Bath instead.

00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:18.000
But the prince is is excusing himself he says have I not discharged 4 of my footmen what more would you have?

00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:28.000
But it was never enough and his expenditure was enormous. You know, it, it, it had a big effect on the, on the treasury.

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The bubble there shows. The Lord Chancellor warning the prince what will happen if he doesn't return if he doesn't cut back.

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Another way which food was used of course was Well, with a lot of innuendo, German sausages are always a little bit suspect in these things.

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And here is the wedding of the Princess Elizabeth to Frederick of Hessa Hamburg.

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He is offering her this this large German sausage and her mother the prayer her mother that the Queen is saying you must and shall have it for your wedding cost what it will.

00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:15.000
Tis the real thing just imported from Coburg. The princess is not so key and she says she'd rather have a rump steak from an English buttock.

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They did use the word butter instead of rump so it's not quite perhaps as rude as it would be today but it's still quite near the knuckle.

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Sometimes the name. Would, give the cartoonists an excuse to pillory you. This is John Montague, the 4th Earl of Sandwich who was a notorious womanizer and particularly liked.

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Working women. So the books that you can see at the back there, sort of bookseller and book binder, books include a list of servant maids and the beauties of Bond Street and she's looking at him.

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Some which carrots were considered to be the best and street sellers were vulnerable to this kind of thing, but you wouldn't want to be alone in a room with the Earl of Sandwich at this stage.

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This too is a very, very famous. Food and politics, cartoon, William Pitt and Napoleon carving up the world between them in 18 0 5.

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There was a kind of false peace in 18 0 5. Gilroy didn't think it could possibly last and they are shown in the way that Caricature still works.

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You exaggerate what people perceive. To be the main feature. So, Pet is can't be key and lanky.

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He's got this huge hat and Napoleon is shown as very small. Napoleon wasn't actually exceptionally small.

00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:55.000
Napoleon was only about an inch or 2 shorter than the Duke of Wellington. But he looked smaller compared to his guard and it was a good way of bringing him down to earth.

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Almost literally. So back to puddings for a moment in 17, by 1719 we were still famous for our puddings and a French visitor said blessed be he that invented pudding, tis a manner that hits the palates of all sorts of people.

00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:17.000
What an excellent thing as an English pudding. We were famous for it. Here's the washerwoman or cook.

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Hard to tell putting the pudding cloth into the cauldron where the washing would have been done, but that was going on still in Victorian and Edwardian times.

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This is perhaps the smallest Napoleon in the whole lot of cartoons. This is George III getting his telescope out to have a look at Napoleon in the palm of his hand and quoting from Gulliver's travels and calling him a little vermin.

00:23:46.000 --> 00:23:53.000
But as I say, you know, it was a good opportunity to bring Napoleon literally down to size.

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Because he was called Bonaparte, it was called Bony and later on Bogey, hence the Bogeyman, but this was a popular verse at the time.

00:24:02.000 --> 00:24:11.000
I won't read it all. I'll give you the chance to do that later. But he seems to have been characterized too to bring us back to food at a bit of a cannibal.

00:24:11.000 --> 00:24:15.000
And he'll beat you, beat you, beat you, and he'll beat you all to pap and he'll eat you, eat you, eat you, gobble you, gobble you, snap, snap, snap.

00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:31.000
That lovely one to read to a child. Is an endlessly influential cartoon. So here are Johnson and Brezhnev at the height of the Cold War.

00:24:31.000 --> 00:24:42.000
They've still got substantial swords. To carve up the world between them. Is I don't understand why it's a baked bean. I've tried to find out.

00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:56.000
This is the bake being in danger, David Cameron and Nicola Sturgeon in 2015 as an anniversary as a tribute really to Gilray but you know again they've still got the same swords and forks.

00:24:56.000 --> 00:25:05.000
By the time you get to Theresa May and Emmanuel Macron in 2,018, Theresa May has got nothing.

00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:14.000
Get macro is carving off Europe at the time of Brexit of course by himself and she's merely throwing up throwing up her hands in horror.

00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:30.000
And most recently, again, Putin, Putin has got Ukraine. Well, on his on his saber, whereas David Cameron has just got a rather pathetic looking knife and fork.

00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:34.000
So as I say, that's probably the most famous one.

00:25:34.000 --> 00:25:35.000
This one is well known too, where a succession of bad harvests caught a bread crisis.

00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:52.000
This is 1795 of course the next big famines were in 1816 and 1817 Some of you may have been at my lecture about 1816 the year without a summer.

00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:58.000
But the butcher supplying John Bull with a substitute for bread is William Pitt again. You can see that beaky nose.

00:25:58.000 --> 00:26:01.000
Jungle here is a thin starving working man. He was often very fat but again he started with Gillery and Cookshack.

00:26:01.000 --> 00:26:17.000
They invented him as a stereotypical, yeoman, but also a poor working man. And you can see at the top there in the little box the prices of provisions compared with the journey as wages just to show her unaffordable bread was and bread was so important.

00:26:17.000 --> 00:26:31.000
People did eat, working Bendini, you know, a quarter loaf a day. So there is the advice.

00:26:31.000 --> 00:26:38.000
Since bread is so dear and you say you must eat, for to save the expense, you must live upon meat.

00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:43.000
And as 12 pence the quarter and you can't pay for bread. Get a crown's worth of meat.

00:26:43.000 --> 00:26:53.000
It was serve in its stead. I think it is a deliberate echo of let them eat cake, though at the time that wasn't attributed to Marie Antoinette, presumably she never said that.

00:26:53.000 --> 00:27:09.000
She would have said brioche anyway, but perhaps she didn't say it at all because it's it's also recorded earlier on before the French Revolution but you know the idea that you had to substitute if you couldn't eat bread you could afford meat is clearly one for ridiculing.

00:27:09.000 --> 00:27:10.000
We have a different cartoon here, right honorables, saving the lobes and dividing the fishes.

00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:26.000
What they're actually eating up is taxes. But the notice reads substitutes for bread and that includes unlikely things like burgundy and champagne, ragues and jellies, turtle soup.

00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:40.000
Fish boiled in wine, no working person could afford those. They're outside in fact with a partition from the starving swine saying grant us the crumbs which drop from your table so we've got sort of 2 biblical references there I think.

00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:50.000
But again, we're coming on to the disgusting, the disgust and the contempt. That people might have felt for those they perceive to be.

00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:54.000
Taking too much of the country to source it. So using food to lock the foreign. Was also quite common.

00:27:54.000 --> 00:28:06.000
Linking war and politics. Again, Gilroy in 18 0 3, Germans eating sauerkraut.

00:28:06.000 --> 00:28:13.000
He looks very like the greens that Queen Charlotte is having for breakfast but it's got those German sausages there again.

00:28:13.000 --> 00:28:28.000
The dog and I had a cat licking the plates. Saora was actually important in a different way because it was beginning to be used on ships to combat scurvy and in that respect it was quite Captain Cook is said to have found that his crew were pretty resistant to eating fermented cabbage.

00:28:28.000 --> 00:28:44.000
So he said that only officers were entitled to it and thereupon his crew felt that they should make a fuss and they got their share of shout the sauerkraut.

00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:51.000
French liberty, British slavery shows again a very, very unhealthy looking jumble on the right there.

00:28:51.000 --> 00:28:59.000
Carving up this huge joint will come on to the roast beef of Old England in a moment.

00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:12.000
But of course the titles are ironic. The idea is that the British, the French thought that the French at the time of the revolution thought were enslaved, were actually eating very well, perhaps too well, that man has got feet thrust into slippers again because of his gout.

00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:20.000
A very unhealthy complexion, but we can't say the Frenchman is doing any better.

00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:32.000
He's eating at what looks like a spring onion. He's in rags. Yeah, his fire is smoking and behind he's got a chamber pot full of crawling snails.

00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:35.000
And this is the same idea really, French happiness and English misery. They are tucking in, of course, to a joint of beef.

00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:47.000
There is a very fat dog and a cat with a mouse, whereas if you look at the cat on the left.

00:29:47.000 --> 00:30:01.000
The cat is too exhausted or possibly even dead. And the mouse is poking its head out and taunting him, the mouse is poking his head out and taunting him, while the Frenchmen are trying to divide a single frog between them.

00:30:01.000 --> 00:30:08.000
For a mail, horrors going on outside. And this one, you know, a baby being roasted.

00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:21.000
This is perhaps the most disgusting of the lot. You're rays. The French are Sanskrit was the word for revolutionaries, but they didn't have no trousers at all, of course.

00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:34.000
They simply didn't have the silk breeches of the aristos. They had they had plain trousers, quite wide, leucous trousers, but here they're cannibals.

00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:40.000
Course themselves on human body parts. I won't dwell on that one, I don't think.

00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:46.000
We mentioned the roast beef and this was part of nostalgia from the beginning. Really, of the 18th century.

00:30:46.000 --> 00:30:52.000
We were great because we ate roast beef. And we are for course the French chordus Ross beef.

00:30:52.000 --> 00:31:05.000
Here is Hogarth showing. A huge joint being taken to the English inn in Calais, watched by a French friar who is poking it because you know he's he's quite fat.

00:31:05.000 --> 00:31:12.000
Like a satire I think against Catholicism. And in the bottom right hand corner, you've got a Jacobite who has got there, you can't see it very well, just a single onion to eat.

00:31:12.000 --> 00:31:23.000
So several bits of satire. Though again, notice no speech bubbles or writing. Hogarth is an earlier era.

00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:33.000
But at about the same time, Henry Fielding wrote a song called The Roast Beef of Old England for his for his play, the Grub Street Opera.

00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:45.000
You can find this on YouTube and it's really quite Quite enlightening and quite funny. They say that he says that roast beef ennobled our veins and enriched our blood, blood, but he goes on in the second verse.

00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:54.000
Since we have learned from all vapor in France to eat their ragus as well as to dance, we're fed up with nothing but vain complex answer.

00:31:54.000 --> 00:32:10.000
Why should we eat French food with French names when we've got our roast beef? In the times of Queen Elizabeth coffee or tea or such slip slops were known, you know, we lived on ale there, we were madly and vigorous.

00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:16.000
Coffee and tea were disapproved on in some in some quarters. The world was in terror if air she did frown.

00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:23.000
And this kind of nostalgia about food is probably still with us.

00:32:23.000 --> 00:32:30.000
This is a similar idea really in 1796. The private supper tables at Vauxhall Gardens.

00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:38.000
Were expensive and they ate what The equivalent really of what we used to call Nouvelle cuisine.

00:32:38.000 --> 00:32:42.000
So a country farmer is saying, damn they don't play like tricks with me but bring me the gamut.

00:32:42.000 --> 00:32:54.000
A couple of slices of thin ham work do. And you notice how French. The waiter on the left looks compared with John Bull.

00:32:54.000 --> 00:33:05.000
Doin Austin used this phrase, the mean and in delicate employment of eating and drinking. She used it in one of the stories that she wrote as a teenager.

00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:18.000
And you know, if you can ever get hold of these, they are really quite funny. Okay. Edward needs to ask relatives for money in order to support his wife Laura and he says what support will Laura want?

00:33:18.000 --> 00:33:21.000
You know, he seems to think she can live on air. Only those very insignificant ones of vittles and drink, answered Augusta.

00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:41.000
Vittles and drink replied my husband in the most nobly contemptuous manner and dust thou then imagine there is no other support for an exalted mind such as my Laura's than the mean and in delicate employment of eating and drinking.

00:33:41.000 --> 00:33:48.000
I think the satire here is actually about the cult of sensibility. You were supposed to add in sense of sensibility.

00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:57.000
You were supposed to be focused on higher things. Above. Such mean things as getting your next meal.

00:33:57.000 --> 00:34:09.000
But the cartoon is thought differently, so people are struggling because of their girth to get to the table here with its wonderful gold.

00:34:09.000 --> 00:34:24.000
Ornaments on it that they are you know looking quite for anetic to get to the food. And here in the drawing room in, in, the, the, of a crowded drawing room, crook shank again.

00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:25.000
2 of them have collided in a doorway and they can't get through all the inconveniences of fashion.

00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:36.000
And of the fact that people were, that just eating too much.

00:34:36.000 --> 00:34:41.000
Lovely detail in that one.

00:34:41.000 --> 00:34:59.000
A big jumble, now a huge junk bull, who is actually eating warships. British cooks cramming, oh grumble wizard, he's eating something called frigacy, Allah, Alla Nelson, so a pun between fricassee which was a kind of wife stew.

00:34:59.000 --> 00:35:08.000
Fashionable at the time and frigates so they're playing on that. That's that's Lord Nelson with scars on his face.

00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:22.000
On the right. He's actually serving up Frigasi, Alla Nelson. It's to celebrate a particular victory in the Napoleonic Wars but notice again true British stout in the foreground.

00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:42.000
Rowlandson was particularly frank about human bodies. This is a relatively innocuous one with plump, it's true, I put bringing in delicacies for for the host and it's just a sign really a picture really of overeating.

00:35:42.000 --> 00:36:01.000
Okay. But this one is something that happened at Somerset House on a particular staircase which was notoriously shaky and he found that if everybody fell down you would notice how little underwear that women are wearing but it is I think quite funny just the same.

00:36:01.000 --> 00:36:11.000
Even Venus at the back there has turned her back on it though she too has. Relatively generous endowments.

00:36:11.000 --> 00:36:25.000
Some Rollinsons were found at Buckingham Palace by Queen Victoria and Albert and they were so disgusted by them that Prince Albert had them all destroyed straightaway so we'll never know what they were.

00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:37.000
Here are a few more that perhaps go a bit further than cartoonists might today. So there is John Bl, someone is saying that is treason, Johnny, but he is letting off what Dr.

00:36:37.000 --> 00:36:47.000
Johnson called an ill wind behind at portrait of George the 3.rd And on the right we've got something called National Conveniences.

00:36:47.000 --> 00:36:52.000
English convenience is fairly dangerous and there is a man there sitting on a water closet again with a foot that's bound I think for the gap.

00:36:52.000 --> 00:37:05.000
Scotch Scotsman use a bucket the French well it just looks as though the convenience has been much overused and the ducks use the lake.

00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:26.000
No comment. The French were very well aware of one particular British habit or what they choose to think of British habit, which is that of having a chamber pot in a corner of the room for gentlemen of course not ladies to use during the meal time and again you can see what they think of typical British behavior.

00:37:26.000 --> 00:37:32.000
The gentleman of course isn't actually able to aim at the party itself.

00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:46.000
So these earlier Georgians perhaps had a more robust attitude to food and eating. And by the late 18th century, we were becoming a bit more fastidious, partly due to this culture of sensibility, where everything, you were above everything like this.

00:37:46.000 --> 00:38:00.000
You may remember the film Tom Jones where he and a lady eat a lot of Disiac food lobsters, juicy fruit, gazing into each other's eyes and it ends with a quick dash to the bedroom.

00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:13.000
Dr. Johnson is very robust about food. I like the 3rd one the best. It has been a common saying of physicians in England that a cucumber should be well sliced and dressed with pepper and vinegar.

00:38:13.000 --> 00:38:23.000
And then thrown out as good for nothing. Some people do feel that way about cucumbers. But he says I look upon it that he who does not mind his belly will hardly mind anything else.

00:38:23.000 --> 00:38:38.000
You couldn't find a late Regency or a Victorian saying anything like that. Austin on food, you know, I've got a whole whole book about this and a given whole series on this, but it just shows you her attitudes were changing.

00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:51.000
But I think it is still satirical. In this story when she was again, when she was a teenager, there the narrator is telling a friend about the fact her system was, this wedding was cancelled.

00:38:51.000 --> 00:38:59.000
So she says after having roasted beef broiled mutton that stewed stew enough to last the new married couple through the honeymoon.

00:38:59.000 --> 00:39:20.000
I had the mortification of finding that I had been roasting, broiling and stewing both the meat and myself to no purpose my sister came running to me in the storeroom with her face as white as a whipped syllabub and told me that Hervey had been thrown from his horse, had fractured his skull, and was pronounced by his surgeon to be in the most eminent danger.

00:39:20.000 --> 00:39:27.000
She means imminent, I think, but there's the syllabab again. And then, good God said she, I said I, you don't say so.

00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:34.000
What in the name of heaven will become of all the vittles and they agree that they're going to have to eat with all up themselves.

00:39:34.000 --> 00:39:42.000
Here I was interrupted by seeing my poor sister fall down to appearance lifeless upon one of the chests where we keep our table in him.

00:39:42.000 --> 00:40:01.000
I think a young lady might be forgiven for fainting on the eve of her wedding when her fiance is likely to die, but it's the humor lies in the narrator who has got all of this food and it the her 1st thought is not about her sister but about what's going to happen to all the food.

00:40:01.000 --> 00:40:19.000
Have a sneaking sympathy with her. So here is how the glass, the recipe writer of her day, here is her recipe for solid silver and you've only got to see the 1st line to see what a lot she's making, 5 pipes of thick cream and half a pint of sack which is wine.

00:40:19.000 --> 00:40:28.000
The juice of oranges and so on. But a version of this of Solid Zilabub is believe me very nice and very nice thing to offer to people.

00:40:28.000 --> 00:40:38.000
Quite refreshing if you don't put too much sugar in. Here's how the glass sharing in the anti-French sense of sentiment determined in losing the phrase.

00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:47.000
Bill of fare and not menu because that pandas to the French. Again, I could put to so many interesting things on the index page there.

00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:50.000
It ends with a certain cure for the bite of a bad dog and a receipt, a recipe to keep clear from bugs.

00:40:50.000 --> 00:40:58.000
Recipe books were very different from their own time.

00:40:58.000 --> 00:41:04.000
She says that she's heard of a cook that used 6 pounds of butter to fry 12 eggs.

00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:06.000
And she says if you used less than that it wouldn't be French. So much is the blind folly of this age.

00:41:06.000 --> 00:41:17.000
That they would rather be imposed on by a French booby than giving orthodox to a good English cook.

00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:28.000
Delia Smith has been a huge fan of Hannah Glass, but Delia Smith herself has been known to talk about, let's say, gravy, I dot zoo all the time.

00:41:28.000 --> 00:41:44.000
In the novels there is a different kind of satire, perhaps irony or characterization, Mr. Woodhouse in ever, the ultimate who lives on nothing but gruel and is constantly trying to stop other people from eating tasty things.

00:41:44.000 --> 00:41:49.000
And Mrs. Elton in Emma, a little shocked at the want of 2 drawing rooms, the poor attempt at route cakes and there being no ice in the Highbury card parties.

00:41:49.000 --> 00:42:05.000
She's a social climber but she doesn't seem to realize that route cakes by their very name are associated with a rather rather scandalous kind of party.

00:42:05.000 --> 00:42:19.000
This is Lady Gadina's route, wrapped of course originally, you know, a military defeat where people withdraw but here again you can see what kind of party it is perhaps.

00:42:19.000 --> 00:42:29.000
It's up to you to have much to eat, but they are playing cards. Route cakes again you can find a recipe online and they are very nice and keep a long time.

00:42:29.000 --> 00:42:39.000
Back to ragu in private prejudice, Mr. Hurst was an indolent man who lived only to eat, drink and play at cards when he found her, Elizabeth Bennett.

00:42:39.000 --> 00:43:01.000
Good prefer a plain dish to a ragu had nothing to say to her. Jane Austen obviously thinks that Elizabeth Bennett would be pretentious if she a ragu, a French titled stew to a plain dish but she's not of course and here is Subsimolism perhaps at Pembly, Mr. Darcy's place where you have a beautiful pyramid of grapes.

00:43:01.000 --> 00:43:13.000
nectarines and peaches. Fruitfulness, the social pyramid, you know, Mr. Darcy is at the top of the tree and of course extraordinarily wealthy with a hot house.

00:43:13.000 --> 00:43:27.000
So, finally then, to leave time for questions, a few thoughts to finish. We mentioned Queen Victoria and Albert being very shocked by Roland and destroying some of his caricatures.

00:43:27.000 --> 00:43:34.000
Zachary wrote in, 1854, so what, 40 years later than our period.

00:43:34.000 --> 00:43:42.000
You're out of the wild, coarse, reckless, rivals, generous book of English humor, which he said in his own times has been washed.

00:43:42.000 --> 00:43:56.000
Combed, clothes and talk of manners has become gentle and harmless, smitten into shame by the pure presence of our women and the sweet confiding smiles about children or sounds very Victorian.

00:43:56.000 --> 00:44:11.000
By 1866 Gilra's copper plates were melted down for the metal and they were the artwork of course the prints were considered SIP that the commentator said it will be absolutely out of the question to reproduce them.

00:44:11.000 --> 00:44:20.000
And there was a sale at which you could obtain them for 2 or 3 shillings. These famous prints which now will cost you hundreds of pounds.

00:44:20.000 --> 00:44:34.000
But it's still not a good idea. Though we appreciate George and cartoons now for a politician to be associated with food, you may be able to think of other examples but Margaret Thatcher, a milk snatcher.

00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:44.000
Is a phrase that comes to mind, you know, where she cut back on the 3rd of the pipes that some of us remember being issued free to primary school children.

00:44:44.000 --> 00:44:53.000
John Selwyn Gummer at the height of the BSE crisis was photographed deliberately with his little girl and a couple of burgers.

00:44:53.000 --> 00:45:06.000
Apparently she refused to eat her. Though I don't suppose it was because she'd heard about the effects of BSE but he ate his for publicity purposes and pronounced it delicious and was of course pillar in the press.

00:45:06.000 --> 00:45:27.000
Poor M. Milliband in the 2,015 election. The song said this is the pig's ear egg made of a helpless Sony in 48 h he could be doing the same same to Britain so you know it's not that easy to eat to bacon sandwich but don't do it if the cameras are on you or you know that they are.

00:45:27.000 --> 00:45:41.000
Ewina Curry. Made the rash pronouncement that all British eggs or almost all British eggs were affected by salmonella and then again had to eat one in public to prove that she could digest it and it perhaps wasn't true.

00:45:41.000 --> 00:45:49.000
And near at our own times you may remember, well it's only 4 years ago but it seems longer help out.

00:45:49.000 --> 00:46:09.000
Eat out to help out. And there is our Prime Minister then Chancellor at the Exchequer, I think, with a name badge that says Rishi in Wagamama serving, but it turns out that it perhaps was such a great idea in the middle of a COVID epidemic to encourage people to read out and make it cheaper for them to do so.

00:46:09.000 --> 00:46:17.000
And then, of course. Back to Marianne to Annette, Boris saying, let them eat birthday cake.

00:46:17.000 --> 00:46:29.000
So any questions of course will be welcome and I hope Vienna has had some but it would be interesting to talk about why 18th and early 19th century cartoons so often use food to make their point.

00:46:29.000 --> 00:46:49.000
You know, why food? We can find many, many examples. And also are we closer to Victorian prudery and restrained or are we more Georgian in our outlook and what kind of foods do we eat now that might compare with what they had to eat and any questions you want to ask about food in general, that would be fine.

00:46:49.000 --> 00:46:55.000
So thank you for listening and I'd like to stop sharing now and hand you back to Fiona.

00:46:55.000 --> 00:46:57.000
Thank you all very much.

00:46:57.000 --> 00:47:02.000
Thanks very much. And okay, we have some questions. I'm gonna start from the top.

00:47:02.000 --> 00:47:08.000
Good.

00:47:08.000 --> 00:47:09.000
Hmm. Hmm.

00:47:09.000 --> 00:47:14.000
And this is from the top. And this is from Bill. And interesting food nationalism and he talks about Robert Barnes deriding ragu, oleo and fricasse in his address to the haggis, what are your thoughts on that one?

00:47:14.000 --> 00:47:20.000
Yes, yeah, yeah, absolutely, yes. And I did read about that, but I forgot to put it in.

00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:37.000
I could have done. Yes. It's the again we have a little bit of this didn't we with Nouvelle cuisine that it generates nationalism and some sentiment against having foreign food foisted on you and the haggis of course.

00:47:37.000 --> 00:47:44.000
I canic isn't it? So understandably. It takes it goes into that poem. Yeah.

00:47:44.000 --> 00:47:59.000
Yep. Okay. Like here's an interesting question from Elizabeth. Did any of the cartoonists or caricaturists ever overstep the mark and become the subject of legal proceedings.

00:47:59.000 --> 00:48:00.000
Hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:09.000
I know you said that it was a little bit easier. And pictures rather than anything else, but did anyone really sort of move overboard?

00:48:09.000 --> 00:48:18.000
During this period, no. Oddly they always seem to get away with there. I haven't read anywhere that any of them actually face libel proceedings.

00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:31.000
There was almost like a double standard. Very many writers, as I say, Shelley got a lot got away with a lot through living in Italy at the time, including criticism of the way Peter Lou was handled.

00:48:31.000 --> 00:48:43.000
But writers in this country often were, or several I know, were imprisoned for libel for talking about Prince Regent though you would think that a really gross cartoon would have been worse wouldn't you?

00:48:43.000 --> 00:48:44.000
But that's not the way their minds seem to work.

00:48:44.000 --> 00:48:49.000
Hmm. Hmm. There we go. There you go, Elizabeth.

00:48:49.000 --> 00:49:00.000
Another question from Jill. Is that a particular museum or gallery that has a collection of these kinds of cartoons and caricatures?

00:49:00.000 --> 00:49:04.000
I love the ones online seem to be from British Museum. There have been there's been an exhibition on tour.

00:49:04.000 --> 00:49:08.000
I heard read about it in Oxford. Oddly I saw a small selection at Lord Byron's place.

00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:18.000
Euston Abbey, which is near where I live in Nottinghamshire. So I think it's more the British Museum or touring exhibitions.

00:49:18.000 --> 00:49:29.000
They are becoming, I think, more and more popular. There isn't 1 that I know of that concentrates on food.

00:49:29.000 --> 00:49:31.000
More politics.

00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:39.000
Yeah. Okay. Really interesting to see at the end those are photos of all our politicians, pictured with food.

00:49:39.000 --> 00:49:41.000
Hmm.

00:49:41.000 --> 00:49:44.000
What do you think about? This is, this is from Jane. What a bit Liz Truss and the famous lettuce.

00:49:44.000 --> 00:49:51.000
Hi, Jay. Oh yes, yes, great, yes of course. Yeah, I should have put that in.

00:49:51.000 --> 00:50:00.000
I knew that something else more reason. Yes, I'll amend that and I'll put this truss and the lettuce in where the lettuce lasted longer than her premiership, yes?

00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:01.000
Is that's the one isn't it? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:12.000
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Okay, what else do we have? Hold on a second.

00:50:12.000 --> 00:50:18.000
Somewhat, someone saying the Royal Pavilion has a large collection. Sure they have, yes.

00:50:18.000 --> 00:50:19.000
Yeah.

00:50:19.000 --> 00:50:26.000
Well, there we go. Right, question from Sue. You talked about, you know, looking at a lot of these character caricatures of all these very wealthy people.

00:50:26.000 --> 00:50:27.000
Hmm.

00:50:27.000 --> 00:50:32.000
Eating. What would ordinary working people have been eating at that point. In those times.

00:50:32.000 --> 00:50:41.000
Right. In the countryside in times of plenty they probably have what we would call a really healthy diet.

00:50:41.000 --> 00:50:51.000
You know, everything home cooked, plenty of vegetables. Vegetables don't feature on the menus of the rich and powerful, but we know from accounts from kitchen gardens that they ate them anyway, but they weren't considered very prestigious.

00:50:51.000 --> 00:51:05.000
Occasionally you get a dish, a dish of new peas or something like that. But in the countryside they would be growing their own vegetables while they had, while they had land.

00:51:05.000 --> 00:51:12.000
Other things came in that made it harder for people in the countryside to eat healthily. Enclosures was one thing.

00:51:12.000 --> 00:51:29.000
No, where they had less access to common land. Industrialization. Was another when in hard times it was in order to survive.

00:51:29.000 --> 00:51:41.000
Shops. But yes, plenty of bread. What bread was much preferred, whereas now It's reversed, isn't it?

00:51:41.000 --> 00:51:54.000
Whole meal bread. Is the is the bread of choice or considered a little bit more Not fashionable exactly, certainly healthier, wipes, sleep, cheap white sliced bread.

00:51:54.000 --> 00:52:02.000
Is the last resort then because it was fine it had to be sifted, it was more valued than brown bread.

00:52:02.000 --> 00:52:06.000
So if they could, they would eat white bread, but often they couldn't and they would eat something that we would regard as more as more wholesome.

00:52:06.000 --> 00:52:15.000
They would have a pig and slaughter a pig and have a little bit. They didn't need a lot of meat.

00:52:15.000 --> 00:52:40.000
So that would be just. Flavoring which happens still in some cultures. They were doing all right except that The climate intervened, again I'm thinking, 1810 to 1820, we had some very very cold winters, leave a side of 1816 and at that point it became impossible to To buy corn, then the Corn laws came in.

00:52:40.000 --> 00:52:56.000
There was a lot working against the diet of ordinary people. But before that and if they have plenty, a pottage for example, which is everything you've got that you can cook, you put in one pot and you make a kind of soup or vegetables too.

00:52:56.000 --> 00:53:05.000
It was extremely healthy. So, you know, it varied a lot. And yes, there was starvation in some years.

00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:15.000
And Terrible conditions in beginning of the Industrial Revolution. If you were lucky, you ate better or more healthily than the Georgians with their huge groaning tables.

00:53:15.000 --> 00:53:18.000
You know, feet bound up because they got gout.

00:53:18.000 --> 00:53:24.000
Yeah, thank you. Question from Jane. Do you think the cartoons? This is interesting.

00:53:24.000 --> 00:53:29.000
Do you think the cartoons are a precursor to the seaside postcard illustrating?

00:53:29.000 --> 00:53:40.000
Yes, I've, I was thinking that myself actually, and I've never seen anybody suggested in any of the literature, but yes, the exaggeration, the, that sort of comic bodies.

00:53:40.000 --> 00:53:45.000
It's very like, isn't it? And we, we don't see those anymore.

00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:46.000
No.

00:53:46.000 --> 00:54:00.000
Do we really? I don't know. I think people collect them. I was reading the other day that people in seaside towns, newsagents and others who would have sold postcards, I was reading the other day that people in seaside towns, newsagents and others who would have sold postcards, younger people now don't know what postcards, newsagents and others who would have sold postcards, younger people now don't know what postcards are, let

00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:05.000
alone seaside postcards. Younger people now don't know what postcards are, let alone seaside postcards are, let alone seaside postcards are, let alone seaside postcards, they can't put them out because people think they're free flyers and take them away So that they don't get paid.

00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:14.000
But yes, used to love the seaside postcards, especially when I was young and they a little bit daring, weren't they?

00:54:14.000 --> 00:54:15.000
Hmm.

00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:23.000
Yeah. The sugar and take in Georgian times seems to be pretty high. Did they also have such a high level of chronic diseases such as diabetes?

00:54:23.000 --> 00:54:29.000
Yes, yes they did. Yes they did. I mean they This was why Bath and other spas were so successful.

00:54:29.000 --> 00:54:40.000
I don't think they did cure diabetes or even mitigate it but it was thought that they did and that's why they went there in such droves and made the places so fashionable.

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:50.000
But yes, gout, diabetes, heart disease. Very common apoplexy. All of those things are diet related.

00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:54.000
They didn't. I mean, when you have those huge groaning tables. In the cartoons, our representative and everything was on the table at once.

00:54:54.000 --> 00:55:10.000
Of course You know, now we think a course is soup in a posh posh menu. Soup, maybe fish, meat or a major vegetarian dish and then dessert.

00:55:10.000 --> 00:55:21.000
They had everything on the table at once. The the big roast would be in the 1st course but round it you might well have things like rice pudding or sponge, something sweet.

00:55:21.000 --> 00:55:31.000
Second course is more or less repetition of the same, though with perhaps may what they call major dishes, fricacies, raguas would come in there.

00:55:31.000 --> 00:55:34.000
So sorry, I forgot what the original question was now, was about.

00:55:34.000 --> 00:55:42.000
Oh hang on, let me just find it and did they also have such a high level of chronic diseases such as?

00:55:42.000 --> 00:55:46.000
But they did, they did, yes, and that was why. And also, of course, a lot of alcohol.

00:55:46.000 --> 00:55:47.000
Yeah.

00:55:47.000 --> 00:55:51.000
Yeah. I'm usually quite sweet. They like their wine very sweet.

00:55:51.000 --> 00:55:53.000
Yeah.

00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:57.000
Someone's saying how strange things are reversed and posher people tend to be slimmer than the poor.

00:55:57.000 --> 00:55:58.000
Yes, absolutely.

00:55:58.000 --> 00:56:04.000
Yeah, and there's a couple of sort of questions and comments here that I'll try and sort of roll together a little bit from Kate and from Carol.

00:56:04.000 --> 00:56:06.000
Yeah. Hmm. Yes, I do.

00:56:06.000 --> 00:56:16.000
Yes, the question about why food was used so much in these caricatures. Kate suggesting perhaps because everyone eats and can relate to it, it's fundamental for us.

00:56:16.000 --> 00:56:25.000
And also, an interesting comment from Carol saying, Food is universal, universal and essential for sustaining life obviously is associated with wealth and poverty.

00:56:25.000 --> 00:56:26.000
Yes.

00:56:26.000 --> 00:56:31.000
Now we have the food banks numbering more than McDonald's in the UK, which has been used in cartoon.

00:56:31.000 --> 00:56:33.000
Yeah.

00:56:33.000 --> 00:56:36.000
So I don't know what your thoughts on that are.

00:56:36.000 --> 00:56:37.000
Do you agree?

00:56:37.000 --> 00:56:42.000
No, no, absolutely. I mean, I agree that food is universal and recognizable. Everybody knows what it was.

00:56:42.000 --> 00:56:53.000
There was a fascination. I would imagine for the middle classes who could afford the prince, prints with a tea, who could afford the prints to see what the, how the rich and powerful were living.

00:56:53.000 --> 00:57:07.000
There were reports in the newspapers the newspapers used to give the menu and you know the extent of things, the huge range of things that were on the table did feature in newspaper articles and so there was a huge interest in food.

00:57:07.000 --> 00:57:23.000
As for now, yes, that is, that is an astonishing statistic. Food backs, but I suppose there is still an interest in great backwards and what people have to eat and also things like, posh restaurants, you know, that suddenly become fashionable.

00:57:23.000 --> 00:57:41.000
Not necessarily the excess but the the way in which strange things like a tripe for example which was very much a working person's food, suddenly becomes modish and you can buy it, you know, in restaurants in central London.

00:57:41.000 --> 00:57:47.000
Yeah, it's a strange thing food, isn't it? But as you say, it's, universal, we all have to have it.

00:57:47.000 --> 00:57:48.000
Yeah, we do.

00:57:48.000 --> 00:57:55.000
We need it. Okay, so I think we've got through all of our questions. Thank you very much for that, Judith.

00:57:55.000 --> 00:58:04.000
Absolutely fascinating, some great images and caricatures. I did like the plum pudding in danger and it's all its various more modern.

00:58:04.000 --> 00:58:05.000
Interpretations.

00:58:05.000 --> 00:58:07.000
Yes, there's more there are there are there are there are dozens there are dozens it's irresistible I think.

00:58:07.000 --> 00:58:13.000
Yeah, and I have to say. I have to see I concur with the physicians about cucumber.

00:58:13.000 --> 00:58:14.000
I'm not a fan, not a fan.

00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:20.000
You, yeah, okay, Dr. Johnson, Dr. Johnson, cucumber.

00:58:20.000 --> 00:58:33.000
Okay, so hope everybody enjoyed that out there. And as usual, don't forget to look out for your email tomorrow with details of some W courses coming up that you may be interested in if you enjoyed the talk today.

00:58:33.000 --> 00:58:35.000
So thanks again, Judith.

00:58:35.000 --> 00:58:37.000
Thank you. Thank you, Fiona. Thank you everybody. Great questions.

00:00:03.000 --> 00:00:13.000
Okay, well hello everyone Yes, many of you will have perhaps seen me before doing other really quite different topics from this one.

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But when you see the pictures you'll understand why I'm a little bit obsessed with medieval vestry creatures because they are just the most characterful things you've ever seen.

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And I shall, for the most part, I won't be, you won't be seeing my face today because there are so many beautiful illustrations that I'll just keep it on the slide show the entire time.

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So if I just share that like so.

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Oh, looking good, Jo.

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You should be now seeing a beautiful panther. All looking good? Beautiful panther, that's what we want.

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The other thing with this one that's slightly different is I'm going to do a little bit of a quiz going on.

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So obviously we can't have see all of your answers, but for some of these creatures, I'll just give you 15 seconds or so to see if you've got any idea what they are.

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And then if you put those answers in the chat, then you can build up your own scores that way.

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I need to figure this out so I can see the chat as well because I can't at the moment.

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Will we we'll get there. Together. Oh there it is.

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Excellent. So yeah, your medieval best jury. Broadly speaking, yes, is a medieval manuscript.

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That focuses on animals. Straightforward enough. And these are compendiums of as many as 100 beasts in some cases.

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And one of the things that's beautiful about them is they take you all the way from animals that they will have seen like a hedgehog via things like lions, exotic beasts, all the way through to fantastical creatures.

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And for each one they're treated in exactly the same way. They have a natural history. They Usually an illustration.

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It's the closest they have to an encyclopedia but it's a lot more than that because there are also moral lessons involved.

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Some of these yes are real animals so are very fantastic ones But they're all given exactly the same treatment in the book.

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They don't really worry too much about that. They're not drawing the line between this is real.

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This is not real. Partly because they don't know and partly because that's not really the point.

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From their point of view, the whole world is the Word of God, God's creation, everything exists.

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In order to reflect something in the universe to teach mankind. So Everything has a meaning. The natural world gets classified as the book of nature and it is our job to read it.

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So that's more important is what lesson is this telling us is more important to them than You know, is it a fish as opposed to something else or what habitat does it live in?

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There are many strange creatures in the Bible anyway. Things which There's a lot of translation errors goes on there but are often translated as things like unicorn and dragon so if they think unicorns and dragons exist then they're not going to worry about the idea that a mermaid exists is a mermaid any more or less unreasonable from a broad description than a lion anyway?

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Maybe not. And if they're in any doubt, they can always just say things like, here be dragons.

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The phrase doesn't actually turn up until the 16th century as far as we know but they are definitely drawing them on the corners of their maps because you can always say something exists in India.

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Or in Ethiopia, which is sort of as far south and as far. East as they have any great knowledge of the existence of.

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And so yes, if you say these creatures are in those places, then who's going to argue with you?

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So for those still looking at the the last picture there, he is a leopard. Although there is a certain amount of confusion in medieval times about the difference between a leopard and a lion, so those who said lion get half a point and it is quite arguable that the 3 lions on our shirts should in fact be 3 leopards.

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There's a lot of linguistic confusion and actual confusion about which ones are taken into vestuaries and indeed taken into menageries.

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People ask for blinds and get leopards and vice versa it's all very silly. Anyway.

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Sometimes we don't even know where the animal came from into their imaginations. What the inspiration was for a particular beast.

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So for instance some best series have in them the Hsinian bird. Who's the main feature of that is the feathers shine so brightly they light up the road on a dark night.

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Sounds terribly useful, you know, stick one on the front of your car. But, yeah, the boundaries, is it real? Is it not?

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Don't really matter. Sometimes seems clear that they know that they're giving a metaphor or an allergy.

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Sometimes it's unclear whether they thought the animal really had these qualities. Or whether it was just an allegory or a teaching point, moral teaching point.

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The important thing about them as well is they're meant to be entertaining and memorable. And you know they are designed to be something that people will go back to and will tell their friends what they've read or heard from these.

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So you do get Some rather strange human. Based creatures like your mermaids. But that mermaid is very much about being a symbol of vanity.

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With the mirror in one hand and the comb in the other. That is very much mermaid as representation of.

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The sin of vanity. Whereas the chap on the other side is a blemy. And he's he's just one of the strange creatures you would find if he went to the ends of the world.

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Not all. People look like us and the big debate with these guys are they real people do they have a soul?

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What exactly are they if they do have soul should we be going out and converting them? But they really believed that people that looked like that lived in southern Africa.

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So I'm not gonna be telling you where all of these illustrations come from because most of the time it's just manuscript.

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5 6 3 8 in this particular library anyway a few of them have kind of well-known names but What I will say is, my absolute recommended recommendation to you if you like these beasties and you want to see more like it The website to go to is just bestery.

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Dot Ca. And it is a wonderful compilation of as many different bestery illustrations as they can find from writer around.

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The world. All nicely arranged with sort of summaries. I'll write that in the chat as well for you.

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There you go. That's all there is to it. Best your e. Now, these things actually start in classical times.

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They're mostly, medieval, but there is a classical route to them. So the great classical authors write encyclopedias, you know, the likes of Pliny the Elder and Aristotle try to condense the whole sum of human knowledge back when that was.

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Still vaguely possible. So the wikipedia of the day, they try to categorize everything.

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Aristotle's into his categorization. And a huge amount of material is brought into that.

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But of course this doesn't have any Christian element to it. There's no moral element. There's no Christian moral element to it.

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These start with physiologus in about 300. Which is he's a Greek chap.

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And there are a few dozen animals and a handful of trees and a couple of rocks in there. It's widely translated, it's put into verse for hundreds and hundreds of years and it's the foundation of everything that comes after, even though it's not.

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Technically a bestery itself it very nearly is. And There are versions of that that keep going through.

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The version in the 10th century Exeter book, which is the book that also has Beowulf in it, Only has 3 animals.

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The rest is all about different things, but it still counts because those animals are dealt with and copied from.

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The physiologic ones. Then you get Isadora Seville? Right in about 600.

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He's got 250 animals in there. This is a big book. And he has He's important because he looks at the works of the likes of Aristotle and combines them with Christian allegory and he is the 1st one to do that.

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So he writes, his, his book is called Etymologies. And the clue there from that.

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Name is that he's really keen on looking at the origins of words to try and explain them.

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So he says for instance that Leo in Greek translates to Wrex in Latin and therefore the lion is the king of the beasts.

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And that's a new idea at the time. The lion should be the king of the beasts.

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And that means that the lion comes 1st in his book. Because he's the 1st one to divide into kingdoms and that is kept throughout pretty much all the vestories later that There are 4 kingdoms in the world.

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They are of the land, of the, of the air, of the sea. And serpents.

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They're not lord of any particular area but they do get their own category. And you know, that's not far off saying animals birds.

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Fish and reptiles except They don't know where to put all of them, but it's sort of getting towards that.

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And so yes, the king of the birds is the eagle. The king of the sea which we see there looking very much unlike what he actually is.

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Is the whale? And the king of the serpents is of course the dragon. So again, real, unreal doesn't really matter.

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And then sort of in the 11th century somebody combines these 2 different texts and you get your proper high medieval best jury that has the reality and the allegory.

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And that text given that They all vary a bit but they all draw on fizzy logis and on etymologies.

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That was the most widely circulated book in medieval Europe. After the Bible. Bonan.

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So, you know, this is a really influential text at the time. And I think it's easy to sort of dismiss it as pretty pictures.

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It is, it's beautiful pictures, but it's also very much about ideas that are in popular consciousness at the time.

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They're generally in either Latin or English or in French if you're in France and scattering of others.

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There are they're divided academically into families depending on you can sort of see the inspirations of one to the next.

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And the person who starts doing that, Widley, is MR James. Who you probably know as a ghost story writer.

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And I mostly know as a zombie. Discoverer of some actual medieval zombie texts so he pops up in some fun places to know my James.

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And then eventually these Best theories get combined into bigger encyclopedias, so you start getting.

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The allegorical religious side starts dropping away and it starts having sections on things like bodily and astronomy and medicine and you get something closer to a proper Encyclopedia.

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And that's kind of what they look like. That's a particularly beautiful example there of what a full

00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:16.000
Bessery looks like with the little illustrations for each one. They are always in almost always in these little frames.

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And very often with beautiful gold detailing either on the thing itself or on the background like in those ones and with the lovely lettering at the side as well.

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Okay. There is a bit of subversion of the form, as with any form that comes up at the time you're always gonna have someone who thinks, ha, that's, that's a, genre that I can use.

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And You get this. I've never heard of this before last week and it is just ridiculous. The best theory of love.

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Very, very popular. Finally the most popular sort of erotic text of its day. It in which so this is 1245 and The writer Roger Dafon of all kind of takes all of the moral stories and allegories of the animals.

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Only stretches the metaphors to breaking point in order to use them to describe his relationship with a young woman who has spurned him.

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So he will say things like, just as dogs in bestuaries return to swallow their own vomit.

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So I wish I could swallow down the improper words I have already spoken towards you. And As a crow eats a corpse's eyes to get to the brain so man is captured by love through the eyes before anything else.

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It's parking. So why did he think that this would in any way be a good way to chat up women?

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I do not. There you go.

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And people enjoy these for a lot of reasons, you know, they're obviously more fun than a lot of texts.

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People can relate to the animals. And their strengths and weaknesses. Vices and virtues and the question, Christian message, you sort of snook in under that.

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Nobles will have them to display their wealth and their learning. Obviously these are certainly the ones we're looking at here or very high status.

00:14:17.000 --> 00:14:30.000
Texts. And also people will. Share them around they are seen as genuinely educational and so people will.

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Yeah, give them as gifts amongst the elite. They're very popular in Lay libraries, monastic libraries.

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In lay scriptoria produce them they can be good inspirations for sermons you know if a priest has one of these you can get all sorts of ideas for just like the panther does this and so will I And of course, part of the appeal is how beautifully illustrated they are.

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The Some of them a lot more realistically detailed than others as we will see but the the square border pretty much remains

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And the 1st proper one in this country is sort of 12, th early 12th century. And you can see some illustrations are inspired by other illustrations the people have seen before by the sometimes by the description in the text.

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But sometimes it's not, sometimes it's clearly just out of their heads. And yeah things like the Harley Bestery the Aberdeen Bestery the Peterborough Bestery amongst the the most beautiful and they have this beautiful rich red detailing and gold work.

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Which of course is a very complicated process of making the medieval manuscript in the 1st place.

00:15:48.000 --> 00:16:00.000
Now Animal imagery turns up a lot in medieval life in other places as well with a wide degree of realism or not.

00:16:00.000 --> 00:16:06.000
So I thought I'd just very briefly Show a few of the other places and I'd take the rabbit as an example.

00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:21.000
So these are best deary rabbits This is how accurate or not they are. I mean look at the face of that one on the left what on earth is going on there On the other hand, the one on the right looks really, really happy with itself, so, you know.

00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:32.000
You are speech bubbles of one in the middle. But they also show up. In other manuscripts in a very realistic style like these fellows.

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I always just want to break down what they're thinking or saying to each other but you find them in carvings and in wall paintings

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With again varying degrees of realism and I mostly just show you these because cause I think they're adorable if I'm honest.

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You would not guess that that one on the left is a genuine medieval piece of art, but it is.

00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:13.000
You find them in manuscript marginalia sometimes with rather odd personalities. They definitely have their own agendas to rabbits in marginale.

00:17:13.000 --> 00:17:24.000
Also, they play the bagpipes and mostly they're quite murderous. Marginalia is another very strange topic that you should look at if you know nothing about because it's hilarious.

00:17:24.000 --> 00:17:33.000
And, and all of this, things turning up in all these other places did get some criticism from the church.

00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:44.000
Something, the whole thing is of course terribly, terribly frivolous. It's sort of the common visual vocabulary of the time is animals because they see them a lot more than we do.

00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:54.000
Bernard of Clever writes in 1127 about wall paintings but the same points could very much apply about best years.

00:17:54.000 --> 00:18:02.000
He says, what profit is there in these ridiculous monsters, them in their marvelous and deformed comeliness, their comely deformity?

00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:08.000
To what purpose are these unclean apes, fierce lions, monstrous centaurs, striped tigers?

00:18:08.000 --> 00:18:15.000
Many bodies are seen under one head or again many heads on one body. Here is a four-footed beast with a serpent's tail.

00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:20.000
There is a fish with a beasts head. Here the 4 part of horse trails half a goat behind it.

00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:25.000
In short, so many and marvellous are the varieties of shapes on every hand.

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That we're tempted to read in the marble more than in our books and to spend the whole day wondering at these things rather than meditating the law of God.

00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:48.000
You see similar arguments if you ever read the name of the Rose. There's a big debate quite near the beginning about all of the artworks in the monastery there.

00:18:48.000 --> 00:19:01.000
So, here is my 1st Very much mystery creature for you. In the category of None of the people drawing these will ever have seen one.

00:19:01.000 --> 00:19:09.000
They're going largely on the name. For their inspiration.

00:19:09.000 --> 00:19:17.000
I've set you off with a hard one to be fair. This is a very hard one. Although the the multicolored might be a slight.

00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:25.000
Okay.

00:19:25.000 --> 00:19:35.000
Fascinating saying camel. If I say you're half right, that will actually confuse you further than and also Lizard is half right.

00:19:35.000 --> 00:19:41.000
Yes, it's a chameleon. It is both a camel and a lion.

00:19:41.000 --> 00:19:51.000
And of course it changes colour. So yes, the the actual physical description they have of a chameleon is pretty good from Aristotle.

00:19:51.000 --> 00:20:04.000
He's obviously knows someone who's seen one. But by the time you get to these 13th century things, so people have gradually got very confused as to whether they should have claws or hooves.

00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:14.000
You know, how many links they should have. A lot of people think, I have no idea what this looks like but it's got the word camel in its name so clearly it must have humps.

00:20:14.000 --> 00:20:26.000
Actually the name comes from the Greek Kamai which means on the ground it's got nothing to do so it's it's actually a ground lion well it doesn't live on the ground any more than it is a camel so Not helpful.

00:20:26.000 --> 00:20:33.000
But, you know, there's a fun bit of artists license going on there, but no one knows why.

00:20:33.000 --> 00:20:38.000
At some point somebody decided it looked like a horse. Just somebody's personal choice. So yeah, whales often have scales as we've seen.

00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:51.000
Ostriches have hooves. Serpents often have feet or wings.

00:20:51.000 --> 00:21:13.000
You can actually watch the this is too small to really see but you can actually see the sort of development of different creatures that are probably inspired by the previous one in some cases and somebody's done that with Elephants so that you can see how different elephants are probably in appearance by other elephants.

00:21:13.000 --> 00:21:33.000
And possibly getting more realistic although when you look at a fellow like that you have to think perhaps not. And in the middle topped the the the trumpet trunk are really quite impressive Whereas at the bottom you have some of the earlier examples.

00:21:33.000 --> 00:21:45.000
So a lot of them Oh yeah, that's just, sometimes the best do start off with Adam and Eve and the story there and the, this is Adam naming the animals.

00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:59.000
Because that's an excuse to draw lots of animals in the same picture, which is rather nice. Already somebody is trying to ride that camel and holding a whip to it I find a little disturbing but That's the medieval monthly.

00:21:59.000 --> 00:22:22.000
So Here is our 1st Christ metaphor beast because if you're starting at the religious end of things then obviously a lot of things are going to be representations of Christ.

00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:40.000
Give you an easy one after that 1st hard one. Yes.

00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:47.000
Yep, what you got there is a pair of lions. So they are thought of as being Christ-like.

00:22:47.000 --> 00:22:52.000
They they wipe their tracks away with their tail to elude the hunter and the way exactly the way that Christ wipes out your sins.

00:22:52.000 --> 00:22:59.000
The the metaphor and allegory game is not always good. To our eyes, it can be very confusing.

00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:07.000
I know those are not lambs you see there, what those are. Is the cubs. But they have very strange idea about the cubs which goes back to having to make it an allegory.

00:23:07.000 --> 00:23:28.000
They say that the cubs are born dead. And on the 3rd day they comes to life when either the mother breathes in their face or the father roars over them.

00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:39.000
So yes, like in Narnia, it's a Christ metaphor. They said to have bones so solid that if you hit them fire flashes out from where you've made the impact.

00:23:39.000 --> 00:23:47.000
And, They also mate face to face. Apparently that would make for a very different version of the Lion King.

00:23:47.000 --> 00:23:53.000
So yeah, we have one Christ metaphor there.

00:23:53.000 --> 00:23:59.000
In the middle there is another one obviously standing between the good creatures on the left and a sort of representation of evil.

00:23:59.000 --> 00:24:10.000
And, and Satan. On the right hand side. And I will come to being licked into shape later, that's actually something else.

00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:15.000
So what is he?

00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:29.000
It is not another leopard, but Similar.

00:24:29.000 --> 00:24:34.000
Come.

00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:39.000
Hey is

00:24:39.000 --> 00:24:47.000
A panther. Yeah, he is a panther. So in the Exeter book. Again, he's a Christ metaphor.

00:24:47.000 --> 00:24:53.000
In the Exeter book. The he's 1 of the 3 that does turn up in that early 10th century version.

00:24:53.000 --> 00:25:04.000
It is said that he will eat, then sleep for 3 days and then wake with a lofty sweet ringing sound and a delightful stream of sweet smelling breath.

00:25:04.000 --> 00:25:11.000
Which attracts towards it everything except dragons. So that's the Aberdeen manuscript version there.

00:25:11.000 --> 00:25:19.000
Rather pretty. I mean, knowing what a domestic cat's breath smells like soon after it's had a large meal.

00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:26.000
I really doubt that delightful stream of sweet smelling breath when it comes to panthers but never mind.

00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:36.000
What about? This fellow, lady.

00:25:36.000 --> 00:25:45.000
Who is also? Being a Christ metaphor.

00:25:45.000 --> 00:26:01.000
Quite right, we have a Pelican and so The pelican, it says in the vestry, as creatures grow they strike their parents in the face with their beaks and the pelican.

00:26:01.000 --> 00:26:10.000
Accidentally kills them because they're hitting it so it hits back. And then the mother peers aside again after 3 days.

00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:19.000
The blood fall onto the dead birds and that revives them. So yeah, it's unclear whether everyone thinks this really happens.

00:26:19.000 --> 00:26:20.000
Apparently what they do in real life is sort of squeeze the bill to their chest in order to get more water out of their pouch.

00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:33.000
Get the most out of the thing but where the blood comes from, who knows?

00:26:33.000 --> 00:26:38.000
Well the Christ figure.

00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:46.000
Grumpiest little one in the world on the left there. He's adorable.

00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:55.000
That's an eagle. And that they have a whole thing about how eagles.

00:26:55.000 --> 00:27:07.000
Renew themselves when they get old when they go up towards the sun and some of their old feathers will burn off and the mist that clouds its eyes will burn off and it will be fresh and renewed again.

00:27:07.000 --> 00:27:13.000
And of course You're most a typical on the rebirth thing. Don't even need to ask that.

00:27:13.000 --> 00:27:18.000
That's clearly a Phoenix.

00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:30.000
No, that's a religious ones that aren't Christ based. Include this so the the drag I wouldn't expect anyone to get this one in a million years This this figure at the bottom is of course being Satan.

00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:42.000
Just sitting there with his with his mouth open. This is one that's actually about a plant not about the animal.

00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:54.000
This is the Peredxian tree which they said grows in India and doves gather in the tree because they love the sweet fruit and they will be safe from the dragon and the dragon would like to eat the doves.

00:27:54.000 --> 00:28:05.000
But it stays on the other side and shaded side. And the doves stay safe in the shadow of the Paradexian tree.

00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:12.000
And if they leave that shadow they will be caught and eaten by the dragon. It's not a very complicated metaphor really.

00:28:12.000 --> 00:28:22.000
You have to stay within the. Within the church and within the light of God but I do think the artwork on those is particularly beautiful.

00:28:22.000 --> 00:28:35.000
It should not be confused despite the similar artwork. With these guys. Who you might have a go out

00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:42.000
Bonus point to get the specific

00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:52.000
Species

00:28:52.000 --> 00:28:57.000
Oh, they are not ducks.

00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:03.000
A couple of people got it right.

00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:12.000
That barnacle geese. Because the idea is That's barnacle piece. Really do?

00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:22.000
Come out of goose barnacles which are quite long thin type of a barnacle. So the barnacles could be on branches or on.

00:29:22.000 --> 00:29:31.000
Rocks and they hatch. And grow these these piece hanging off them and then that becomes a barnacle goose.

00:29:31.000 --> 00:29:38.000
Again, how many people actually believe this is something that's very hard to tell but

00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:48.000
They have fun, aren't they? And then just that enthusiastic dive down. Okay, the dragon of course is pretty much always the bad guy in the best.

00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:56.000
He is the king of the lizards. And comes in all sorts of forms from the very straight.

00:29:56.000 --> 00:30:03.000
Creature called the ayaculus which is Also where the word javelin comes from.

00:30:03.000 --> 00:30:15.000
And it's basically a snake that launches itself out of trees and is so pointy of nose that it goes right through into its prey like a javelin.

00:30:15.000 --> 00:30:24.000
All the way from that kind of thing up to This, this marvelous fellow. Now, this is The 1st known picture.

00:30:24.000 --> 00:30:27.000
Or they 4 legged dragon. Before that, they're always 2 legged because they're sort of like birds, aren't they?

00:30:27.000 --> 00:30:43.000
One pair of wings, one pair of legs. So in the Western tradition one should say. So this is the 1st time somebody drew a 4 legged dragon and I just love the logic here.

00:30:43.000 --> 00:30:49.000
But hang on, if it's got 4 legs Then it's got to also have 4 wings.

00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:58.000
And that is not a pattern I've seen anywhere else, but the 1st one. It is a rather beautiful 4 wind chap.

00:30:58.000 --> 00:31:08.000
And that's from the English Bestuary of 1236. Generally they are involved in battles of good and evil.

00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:22.000
And in these stories, good is very often represented. Bye an elephant. And the best trees tell us that dragons attack elephants with their tail and then they suffocate them.

00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:29.000
And they are the only enemy of the elephant, the only creature that could kill them. If that were true.

00:31:29.000 --> 00:31:35.000
Bartholomew the English says that the 2 have everlasting battle. The 2 of them.

00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:42.000
Dragons are afraid of deep water, so elephants go into a pool of water to give birth.

00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:50.000
So that the babies can't get eaten by the dragon. Yes, it's a scene that turns up quite often.

00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:53.000
I think on this one in the middle, they also said that the elephant could use it quite often.

00:31:53.000 --> 00:31:56.000
I think on this one in the middle they also said that the elephant could use its trunk as a periscope.

00:31:56.000 --> 00:32:14.000
So that's why it's all curled up like that. But yes, all sorts of battles and the dragon world, generally speaking, lie in weight swoop down, wind its tail and either crush or suck the blood of the elephant until it dies but upon the elephant falling.

00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:22.000
Then that will also crush the dragon to death. So it ends up being the seed of its own destruction.

00:32:22.000 --> 00:32:32.000
This one curled around the feet is quite interesting that maybe they had noticed that dragons, elephants find it quite hard to get up.

00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:40.000
And of course that one is probably a bowa constrictor or something similar in its original story. It's a big steak, isn't it?

00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:47.000
Panthers also have fights with dragons by the eggs Panthers being a Christ symbol.

00:32:47.000 --> 00:32:56.000
Some of them, creatures just embrace, in body vices and virtues. And we still do that, you know, when we say that lions are brave and foxes are cunning and so on.

00:32:56.000 --> 00:33:09.000
Those things are partly based on the act of animals but they're also based on these ideas which come straight out of the medieval bestories actually.

00:33:09.000 --> 00:33:14.000
And they go further with all of that than we do. For instance, they would tell you, what's this creature?

00:33:14.000 --> 00:33:19.000
It's another easy one.

00:33:19.000 --> 00:33:23.000
This particular beast is so vain.

00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:31.000
Yeah, that's a peacock. And it is so vain that it believes itself to be absolutely adorable and perfect.

00:33:31.000 --> 00:33:37.000
And then it notices its own feet and sees the ugliness of its own feet and screams in horror.

00:33:37.000 --> 00:33:42.000
And whenever you hear a peek making a loud noise, it's because it's screaming at the ugliness of its own feet.

00:33:42.000 --> 00:33:47.000
Which, yeah, I can't hear a peacock making a noise without thinking of that now and now neither can you.

00:33:47.000 --> 00:34:08.000
It's great. He goats are all about lust. Tying in with a broader classical idea of everything being this sort of balance of metaphorical hot wet cold dry lust and anger are seen as hot in emotions and you know we'd still talk about being hot-blooded or hot-tempered.

00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:16.000
A he-goat is so hot-blooded, according to the bestuaries. That it's blood can dissolve diamond.

00:34:16.000 --> 00:34:21.000
Not by going.

00:34:21.000 --> 00:34:29.000
Conversely, curiously. It's creature. It's not the blood that can do special things.

00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:40.000
It can digest. So what's that?

00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:47.000
In spite of his clover hooves, which are of course completely wrong.

00:34:47.000 --> 00:34:58.000
Yeah, that is an ostrich. And they thought that ostriches had feet like camel feet.

00:34:58.000 --> 00:35:07.000
And they thought The ostrich is sort of the opposite of the hegoes. The he goat can dissolve iron, it can dissolve diamond in its blood.

00:35:07.000 --> 00:35:17.000
The camel is so cold in nature that it can digest iron. And even eat glowing iron in some versions.

00:35:17.000 --> 00:35:22.000
And what's going on on the right hand side here is that they don't sit on their eggs, it says.

00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:29.000
They just wait for the sun to keep them warm. And also in some versions that they hatch their eggs by staring at them.

00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:39.000
Which is a lovely thought if that worked.

00:35:39.000 --> 00:35:45.000
Now, here's a tough one. What animal is that? Those are the same animal.

00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:59.000
Which is one that is bizarre because Certainly some of the further east and south. People should have known what this actually looked like.

00:35:59.000 --> 00:36:06.000
I think they get muddled with a lot of animals. I can see, you know, getting muddled with a walrus might be part of it.

00:36:06.000 --> 00:36:24.000
Okay, try and make it a little bit easier for you. How about that one? Same creature again.

00:36:24.000 --> 00:36:34.000
You have to give him a longer nose. Yeah, he's a crocodile. As allegedly, these 2 fellas also crocodiles.

00:36:34.000 --> 00:36:50.000
It's 1 of the more outlandish ones that they do. And I bring him up because he's a nice example of how some of the stories from bestories have become metaphors in the English language to this day.

00:36:50.000 --> 00:37:01.000
And of course, although none of the pictures show it for some reason, one thing about the crocodile that it's says in the vestry texts is that they cry false tears.

00:37:01.000 --> 00:37:12.000
And so this is where crocodile tears come from. They were thought to be literally something that the crocodile did during or after its meal in a sort of false repentance.

00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:19.000
Another phrase that we have from the vestuaries, I haven't got a picture for that one unless they're in the other order.

00:37:19.000 --> 00:37:34.000
Okay, do it that we're on. Is this? So who is this and what's he doing?

00:37:34.000 --> 00:37:47.000
Yeah. That is a bear. Licking his cubs into shape. And when we say, oh, you know, I'll lick them into shape, whatever.

00:37:47.000 --> 00:37:56.000
We are going back to the vestery where it was literally said that bears give birth to shapeless lumps like the ones in the bottom right there.

00:37:56.000 --> 00:38:09.000
And it literally licks them into shape because they are born. Too soon effectively they're born formulas and so the work has to be done after that.

00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:10.000
And that's a there's a Shakespeare sonnet that is Shakespeare?

00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:21.000
No, a Dom Sonnet that uses that. As a metaphor as well.

00:38:21.000 --> 00:38:27.000
Which leads me to one of my favorite little bestery stories about how animals look after their young.

00:38:27.000 --> 00:38:44.000
And this is this is the hedgehog. If you look at best your hedgehog on YouTube you will find there is the most gorgeous little animation of this particular story done with with little filtered creatures and I could watch it over and over.

00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:54.000
Because they said that this is a thing that they do. They, they're sensible information about some of these animals again.

00:38:54.000 --> 00:39:01.000
I'm picking on some of the sillier ideas, but they would also tell you about them curling up into balls as defensive measures, for instance.

00:39:01.000 --> 00:39:06.000
However, that's more useful than the beliefs in the best ways that they can independently block each nostril.

00:39:06.000 --> 00:39:17.000
They have 2 anuses and you should eat them if you have leprosy. The best bit yes they they roll on the ground Yeah, Jane has it right there.

00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:24.000
They roll up to pick the pick up apples and grapes on their spikes. And then they go back, roll over.

00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:30.000
And then the babies can get at those.

00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:43.000
Specially selected fruit off the back of their spines. Isn't that adorable? Look for just a couple of defense measures, I think.

00:39:43.000 --> 00:39:47.000
Best beast in the world this.

00:39:47.000 --> 00:40:08.000
Not quite a real animal and again one I would not expect you to get unless as it happens you watch have I got news for you this week because I don't know if it was in the short version or just the extended version but for the 1st time probably ever this chap made national television and he and his luck was talking about him.

00:40:08.000 --> 00:40:12.000
This is the Bomicon.

00:40:12.000 --> 00:40:26.000
He's a Bonacon. He's wonderful. The balcony is a creature that the besteries say with the main of a horse, say, with the main of a horse, the head like a bull with horns that curl in towards each other. The head like a bull with horns that curl in towards each other.

00:40:26.000 --> 00:40:30.000
It might be based on the extinct European bison which curl in towards each other. It might be based on the extinct European bison which did have horns that curved that way.

00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:36.000
But of course the horns are useless as defense because of how they curl, so the bonacon has to have another weapon.

00:40:36.000 --> 00:40:47.000
And what it does is expel its dung out to a great distance, sometimes as far as being able to spread too awkward in a single Expulsion.

00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:55.000
And this burns anything it touches as though touching fire. It is noxious noxious stuff.

00:40:55.000 --> 00:41:12.000
And it's 1 that they love drawing as a picture because of the comedy value of it. So in these it's just worth focusing on the face of the person and indeed the face of the animal as it does its Does its deed.

00:41:12.000 --> 00:41:17.000
There's another one.

00:41:17.000 --> 00:41:26.000
Looks more like a Enthusiastic puppy. Possibly the best of the lot.

00:41:26.000 --> 00:41:34.000
That's that face. That is the face of a dog that knows it's about to be blamed for having felt it in the room, isn't it?

00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:41.000
Like. I know we did that. Sorry. But those eyebrows?

00:41:41.000 --> 00:41:51.000
There's 1 not on a pestery, but there's 1 in Longthorpe Tower in Peterborough where they've added to the joke by putting it directly above the doorway above the archway.

00:41:51.000 --> 00:42:00.000
So whenever anybody came in to the room, the Lord sitting on his table would get a perfect view of the person coming in.

00:42:00.000 --> 00:42:12.000
With a bonacon immediately above them. Projecting onto them as they come through the door. That is medieval humor at its finest.

00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:27.000
Speaking of self-defense or avoiding hunters What's that?

00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:32.000
No, not a wolf.

00:42:32.000 --> 00:42:42.000
Nope. You have to make its legs a lot shorter. And.

00:42:42.000 --> 00:42:49.000
And the ears are lot smaller.

00:42:49.000 --> 00:43:03.000
It's a beaver. Believe it or not. And as Gerald of Wales puts it, when the Beaver finds that he cannot save himself from the pursuit of the dogs that follow him.

00:43:03.000 --> 00:43:16.000
You may ransom his body. That by the sacrifice of a part. He throws away that which by natural instinct he knows to be the object sought for, and in the sight of the hunter castrates himself.

00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:36.000
To which circumstance he has named the game to the name Castor Latin for Beaver that is not the etymology at all that's just them reaching If by chance the dogs should chase an animal which has been previously castrated, he has the sagacity to run to an elevated spot and lift up his leg to show that the object of his pursuit is already gone.

00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:49.000
Because People believed. That castorium which was a very prized substance came from the testicles of a beaver.

00:43:49.000 --> 00:44:00.000
It actually comes from some sort of internal glands. But it is one of the things that was prized about the beaver and until fairly recently it was still used in perfume.

00:44:00.000 --> 00:44:05.000
They have, you know, substitutes now, but anal glands of beaver is definitely a the thing that's been used for a long time.

00:44:05.000 --> 00:44:15.000
But they, well. Classical authors, Aristotle have told you it's not from the testicles, but medieval people thought it was.

00:44:15.000 --> 00:44:23.000
And so these are beavers ripping off their own testicles in order to escape from the hunters.

00:44:23.000 --> 00:44:33.000
Okay. Yeah, that it's Civet is the the one more I think. Because you were promised this one.

00:44:33.000 --> 00:44:37.000
In the original bloop.

00:44:37.000 --> 00:44:49.000
What are they? If you know the weird thing that they're actually doing.

00:44:49.000 --> 00:45:05.000
No, not not bats although the The bestery bats are adorable and you should look them up because yeah the position that they think the wings should be in is very odd.

00:45:05.000 --> 00:45:11.000
Not, one correct answer in that lot.

00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:25.000
They're badgers. And these badges are showing a remarkable amount of teamwork. And again, a lot of the information about badges is good correct information, but some of it is Very strange and has come about via Chinese whispers probably.

00:45:25.000 --> 00:45:39.000
So in this case They thought that badgers could and did. Use each other as a cart for shifting things around.

00:45:39.000 --> 00:45:45.000
They thought the beavers could do that as well, that beavers would use each other as a cart for helping with the dam building.

00:45:45.000 --> 00:45:51.000
One of them would lie upside down and the others would put bits of sticks and logs on it.

00:45:51.000 --> 00:46:10.000
In the case of the badgers, the point is that apparently badgers like gold. And so what they are doing is digging in the mountainside for gold and one lies upside down as you see there with the stick in his mouth and the others pile theirs onto its tummy and then the 2 badges will drag the the loaded badger away.

00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:17.000
The best explanation anyone's ever come up with for this that I've seen is that Somebody might have told them.

00:46:17.000 --> 00:46:27.000
About honey badgers in Ethiopia. Which dig for what was known as Ethiopian gold, which is to say honey.

00:46:27.000 --> 00:46:35.000
And they individually dig for honey. So at some point someone had this idea about badgers digging for gold and how on earth was that going to work?

00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:43.000
And you know, apparently this is how that works. So yeah, there are some very, very strange beasts.

00:46:43.000 --> 00:47:04.000
I have you 2 headed snake. Apparently there are fairly reputable stories that very very rarely this does actually happen you get the snakes with the heads kind of going that way but It's, you know, what in a many 1 billion chance but it has been reported of a snake doing what that guy is doing there.

00:47:04.000 --> 00:47:14.000
He's known as an amphyspena. And Yeah, he's a push me pull you of the snake world.

00:47:14.000 --> 00:47:20.000
So, yeah, these are the things you need to know about bestories. They are beautiful. They are.

00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:31.000
Characterful they are full of very strange metaphors Very strange details. And also sometimes really accurate ones.

00:47:31.000 --> 00:47:39.000
All mixed up together. And that is me over to you for any questions I think.

00:47:39.000 --> 00:47:52.000
Thanks very much Jo. We have some questions here. I'm just going to fire away. No, let me just scroll up the chat to find the 1st one.

00:47:52.000 --> 00:47:53.000
So.

00:47:53.000 --> 00:47:57.000
And we got lots of chat here with all your your guesses of all the different animals. Now.

00:47:57.000 --> 00:48:05.000
And you talked right at the start about the bestiary kind of being the most widely circulated text after the the Bible.

00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:06.000
Hmm.

00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:10.000
Was that a specific best theory and if so, what was the name of it?

00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:15.000
No, that's if you say that a family of best trees are all based on Etimology on Isidore's etymologies.

00:48:15.000 --> 00:48:23.000
So it's sort of that they're all reading Isidore's etymologies, but they're all reading.

00:48:23.000 --> 00:48:30.000
Different versions of that which people have put their own spins and tweaks on over the next 400 years.

00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:31.000
Does that make sense?

00:48:31.000 --> 00:48:36.000
Right, okay, so that's the question from Madeline, so I hope that answers that for you.

00:48:36.000 --> 00:48:45.000
No, we had another question. Let me just try and find it from Kate. And give me a little seconds.

00:48:45.000 --> 00:48:53.000
Yes, here we are. So this is from Kate. And it was when you were showing us the image of the lions and the cubs.

00:48:53.000 --> 00:49:02.000
So I think that's what, was referring to. And do you think, H, heronymous Bosh's garden of earthly delights is a relative of these.

00:49:02.000 --> 00:49:13.000
Okay. Oh, I'd never considered that, but they certainly draw on some of the same sort of Medieval imagination, don't they?

00:49:13.000 --> 00:49:23.000
I think the best, I think images probably have more in common with Medieval marginalia creatures.

00:49:23.000 --> 00:49:40.000
If you look those up because in those you're more likely to get Things that are absurd at the same time as being horrific or, you know, I mean, there's a lot more fart jokes and things like that, but there's also a lot of just combinations of things and faces where they shouldn't be faces and people blowing instruments where that shouldn't be possible and that kind of thing.

00:49:40.000 --> 00:49:57.000
And I think that probably gets you closer to Bosch in spirit. But that's it, the best theories and the manuscript marginalia share a fair bit of DNA anyway.

00:49:57.000 --> 00:49:58.000
So yes.

00:49:58.000 --> 00:50:05.000
Okay, there we go, Kate. And from Jane, and when we were looking at the barnacle geese.

00:50:05.000 --> 00:50:06.000
No?

00:50:06.000 --> 00:50:11.000
Growing out of their barnacles. And which book were those from?

00:50:11.000 --> 00:50:20.000
I see again, I can't tell you exactly, but if you go to, Mystery Ca and go through all the pictures of Barnacle geese, it'll tell you there.

00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:22.000
Yeah, I don't know.

00:50:22.000 --> 00:50:27.000
Bye. Okay, there we go, Jen. And a little project for you. Okay, now let's have a look to see what else we have.

00:50:27.000 --> 00:50:47.000
Quick.

00:50:47.000 --> 00:50:48.000
Hmm.

00:50:48.000 --> 00:50:54.000
Right from Norman. Could the very naturalistic animals on picked us symbol stones. Be seen as a kind of pro best theory up to.

00:50:54.000 --> 00:50:55.000
That's a question.

00:50:55.000 --> 00:51:10.000
Oh well, I mean Yeah, I isn't the whole, as I understand it, the whole thing with the picture stones is that There are huge mysteries around Why they were created and, you know, exactly what the interpretation of them is.

00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:21.000
Certainly you can see a through line from things like the picture stones into things like the Lindisfarne Gospels and the Book of Kells.

00:51:21.000 --> 00:51:32.000
And then from the artwork in those some of which is surprisingly realistic. There's a cat in the the Let us smell gospels that the face is, it's not on.

00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:45.000
And then from there through towards this kind of image there is definitely a through line there, but I think we really don't know what the purpose of the Pictish ones is as far as I'm aware.

00:51:45.000 --> 00:51:51.000
Hmm. Okay, there we go, Norman. From Louise, how many images are there?

00:51:51.000 --> 00:51:53.000
Well, I'm assuming that there are. That sounds

00:51:53.000 --> 00:52:04.000
Oh, hundreds. There are about a hundred good, solid, fairly complete bestories left. Which are different as I understand it.

00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:11.000
And some of those are quite short and just a handful and others are in a hundred-plus images.

00:52:11.000 --> 00:52:12.000
So, animals will turn up in every single one, some animals only turn up occasionally. Snakes is ridiculous.

00:52:12.000 --> 00:52:42.000
There are like 30 different snakes and sometimes it has to be that these are different versions of the same one because there isn't enough distinction and they tend to have different names in different manuscripts but overall there are hundreds and hundreds of these pictures and they are a quite wide stylistic range there are some particularly some of the later bestaries, like there's a 1 that has a very realistic, beautiful dragonfly in

00:52:46.000 --> 00:53:00.000
it. You think that person must have looked at a dragonfly and then you look at another one and there's a picture of a spider and it's as if this person has never seen a spider before even though they are, easy to go out and observe, one would think.

00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:01.000
They're old.

00:53:01.000 --> 00:53:17.000
Okay. There we go, Louise. No, this from Angela. Do you think some of them have been inspired by Anglo-saxon animals on jewelry, etc, which have a long intertwined arms.

00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:39.000
Yes, if you, again, this through line through from Anglo-saxon craft and, to a lesser extent, some Vikings craft, but if you look at the Anglo-saxon jewelry intertwined, they called lassetines that's a very very long skinny intertwined beasties with the feet they're called lassettines and they are in the

00:53:39.000 --> 00:53:48.000
jewelry, they're also in of the medieval, sorry, best of the Anglo-saxon illustrated manuscripts.

00:53:48.000 --> 00:53:54.000
And then when you look at something like the Aberdeen Bestuary that has this ornately intertwined paradoxian tree, I think it's fairly clear that there's been a continuous line through there.

00:53:54.000 --> 00:54:05.000
In terms of how you do not work. There is definitely a Celtic vibe Celtic.

00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:08.000
Laceteen vibe to some of them.

00:54:08.000 --> 00:54:21.000
Okay, there we go, Angela. And from Kim. What do we know about the people who illustrated the best areas?

00:54:21.000 --> 00:54:22.000
Well, for most of the time that we're talking about, they will have been done in monasteries.

00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:32.000
They would have been done in Scriptoria by people who, you know, that's their daily job.

00:54:32.000 --> 00:54:45.000
We know quite a lot about their lives because it's dictated by whichever monastic rule and also because they write funny little things on the side of manuscript sometimes like you know, please make this day be over.

00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:53.000
Alcohol killed me last night. This page is too hairy. My ink is frozen. Stuff like that.

00:54:53.000 --> 00:55:03.000
So we know a little bit about their lives. Now towards the end of the period when you're talking sort of 15th century you start getting this rise of private Victoria.

00:55:03.000 --> 00:55:11.000
Who are people who will produce books for you. And they're still sort of religious establishments but they don't have all of the rules and they are a commercial enterprise.

00:55:11.000 --> 00:55:27.000
Because some people can pay enough to have beautiful little books of hours with their favorite prayers and some nice pictures in and they Pretty is quite few best theories because it's quite a popular thing for a nobleman to want to copy off.

00:55:27.000 --> 00:55:36.000
So their lives are a bit more. They'll be based in towns and a little bit more of a normal secular life.

00:55:36.000 --> 00:55:44.000
Okay, there we go, Tim. Right, I think we have got several of these questions, I think.

00:55:44.000 --> 00:55:53.000
Thanks very much for that Jo. That was absolutely fascinating and really rather entertaining. I particularly like the peacock feet.

00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:54.000
Yes.

00:55:54.000 --> 00:55:59.000
Logic. I do like that one. And obviously the illustrations are absolutely fantastic, can't they?

00:55:59.000 --> 00:56:00.000
At the same character. Personalities.

00:56:00.000 --> 00:56:06.000
Yeah. Okay, so hope they enjoyed that. I certainly did.

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And don't forget to look out for your email tomorrow with some other W courses that you might be interested in if you like today's.

00:56:15.000 --> 00:56:22.000
So once again, thank you very much, Jo.